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Indiana Gov. signs "religious freedom" bill into law

Discussion in 'Sports and News' started by SnarkShark, Mar 26, 2015.

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  1. franticscribe

    franticscribe Well-Known Member

    Is his freelance business set up as a corporation where he advertises his services to the public, a la "Jim's Nuptial Organ Music and Such" or is he someone who takes his freelance gigs via word-of-mouth? Also is he uncouth enough to tell the same-sex couple "I can't do your wedding because you're gay" instead of "sorry, my schedule is full?"
     
  2. doctorquant

    doctorquant Well-Known Member

    Let's assume he doesn't advertise, but let's also assume it's a small town so likely as not his side gig is pretty widely known.

    Let's assume he simply says, "I'm terribly sorry, but I just can't participate in your wedding. I wish you two all the best, though, and if you need some help finding someone suitable to play, I'd be glad to help you with that."
     
  3. The Big Ragu

    The Big Ragu Moderator Staff Member

    I'll leave that one to you.

    I'm concerned with the fact that there are people like Jim O'Daniels out there. ... you know people who make their business decisions based on the social category of the people requesting the business. I find it small minded and scary and a scourge.

    I'll leave the esoteric debates people create to avoid discussing his actual bigotry to you. I'm not looking to fine him or create regulations around his sad behavior. I'll settle for being the guy who speaks out against him and his small mindedness. Any day of the week.
     
  4. doctorquant

    doctorquant Well-Known Member

    Seriously Rags ... You'd do well to dial it back. As I understand it you're not a believer, so maybe you can't process the idea that it actually might be a heartfelt conflict. That Jim might indeed be stuck between a figurative rock and a hard place. That he might be willing to lay down his life for either of the two participants yet still be unwilling to participate in their wedding. That, indeed, it is possible that the hour of their wedding would be the only hour of their lives during which he would treat them differently than anyone else.

    It's not as easy as you're making it out to be. At least not for everyone. A touch more modesty in the face of that reality might suit you much better.
     
    old_tony likes this.
  5. The Big Ragu

    The Big Ragu Moderator Staff Member

    By a touch more modesty, I take it you mean that I should be understanding of the reasons for his bigotry?

    He (and people like him) makes the world a worse place, in my opinion. Same as the person who wouldn't serve blacks. Same as the person who would discriminate against women. Or the person who wouldn't do business with Jews.

    They all had their reasons.

    It stems from small-mindedness, ignorance and hatred, I imagine. But it doesn't really matter what I imagine. And I am certain it doesn't matter to a gay person who has to live knowing there are people like Jim who sit in nonsensical judgment of them and will treat them poorly compared to others. Categorizing Jim's type of bigotry as a heartfelt conflict doesn't make it better bigotry.

    I'll assume Jim has the power of reason. I don't care how heartfelt you tell me his conflict is. He's responsible for his decisions. And bigotry is bigotry.
     
  6. doctorquant

    doctorquant Well-Known Member

    No, I mean you might exhibit a bit more modesty with respect to your monopoly on morality. Put simply: Your reason is likely not as infallible as you seem to think.
     
    old_tony likes this.
  7. SnarkShark

    SnarkShark Well-Known Member

    Just so we're all on the same page, the Bible verse so often used to oppose homosexuality (Leviticus 20:13) also calls for those engaged in the "abomination" to put to death.
    Leviticus 20:13 KJV - If a man also lie with mankind, as he - Bible Gateway
     
  8. doctorquant

    doctorquant Well-Known Member

    Actually, it's the Pauline passages -- Romans 1:26–27, 1 Corinthians 6:9–10, and 1 Timothy 1:8–11 -- that are the most troubling to those Christians who oppose homosexuality/same-sex marriage. Plenty of Christians work around these, mind you, but these are the ones.
     
  9. SnarkShark

    SnarkShark Well-Known Member

    You are absolutely correct. Those are rough ones as well. I was going for the maximum impact of the explicit death sentence.
     
  10. old_tony

    old_tony Well-Known Member

    Not only is it "not pizza," it has no place even relatively near a conversation about pizza.
     
  11. Twirling Time

    Twirling Time Well-Known Member

    Not being able to get a pizza in Rome is a bit like not being able to get snow in Buffalo. Ludicrous.
     
  12. old_tony

    old_tony Well-Known Member

    The "protections" the left is screaming for from this law didn't exist in the previous years since the federal RFRA went into effect in 1993, so I'm thinking there should be a ton of examples of Christians oppressing LGBTs to which our friends on the left can point -- particularly in troglodyte Indiana. Anyone up for posting links to these hundreds of slights?
     
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