People Magazine: Jenner "transitioning into a woman"

The 'award' says more about the brothel presenting it than the whore acceptng it.

 

One of my favorite replies ever on this site was when someone, responding to a post that fell apart at the end, responded thoughtfully to the first part of the post, and then asked if the poster had a stroke mid-post.

Can't remember who said it, or else I would credit them.

 

I read Jenner's Wikipedia page yesterday.

I disagree with changing the pronouns during his Olympic feats to "her."

 

Me too.

I guess the argument is that Jenner was always a woman, but at the time, she publicly identified as male. The person entered in the events was Bruce Jenner.

I know people want to be as deferential as possible, but I think they're tripping over themselves.

Muhammad Ali was still known as Cassius Clay the first time he fought Sonny Liston. We wouldn't go back and change that history.

Jenner may have always, to some degree, identified as a woman. But his "name" in 1976 was Bruce.

Saying that Bruce Jenner won the decathlon isn't denying history. It's not disrespectful to the person she is now.

 

I wonder - and I know this sounds right out of screech radio, but I can see it happening - if at some point, the movement will demand that a man who self-identifies as a woman gets to compete against women in athletics. I think, though, that there's some nuanced distinction, even among the truest of the true believers, between "gender" and "sex."

I also wonder what the odds are that, at some point, Caitlyn quietly becomes Bruce again.

 

In a world where we have pre-teens who identify as transgender, this is inevitable, and is probably happening already in youth leagues around the country.

It's far greater than zero.

Caitlyn may tire of being a ground breaker, and an icon. She's going to face pressure to uphold an image every minute, of every day.

But, also, with the surgeries she's already had, she may never be able to "look like" Bruce again if she did want to go back.

That makes me worry about suicide more than it makes me think she may ditch Caitlyn for Bruce.

 

I don't think this is necessarily true. It'll all blow over in a year or two and everyone will move along to the next bright, shiny object.

Kind of like what happened to Chaz Bono.

 

Do you mean like Fallon Fox, the transgender female MMA fighter? She has been a fairly polarizing topic for those who follow MMA. It is especially complicated because she competes in a sport in which you are trying to physically harm your opponent.

I believe Fallon Fox has undergone all the hormone treatment and surgeries involved with the transition, so her case may not be the kind you are referring to. I'm not 100 percent clear on the terminology but I'm sure there is a difference between someone who self-identifies and someone who has gone through the transition.

 

It's like these teams that change cities but keep the records of the old team. We all know damn well the Oklahoma City Thunder didn't win the 1979 NBA Championship.

 

yeah, apparently my Nobel level post got lost in the internet ether.

How many people have thought about Bruce Jenner in the past 10 years? It was only because of his wife, kids and extended family. And what you probably thought was a combination of 1) that guy used to be someone I cared 2) what an asshole for letting himself get invloved in a freak show.

On reflection, he becomes the star attraction in the freak show and his accomplishments were fleeting and aberrational

 

Purely speculating of course.

But, there's a lot of pressure on a trans woman to look, well, like a woman. Now, Caitlyn is obviously famous, so it's not like people will not already know she is trans, but it's still a lot to deal with on a daily basis.

And, it's not just looking like a woman, it's looking good as a woman.

You might remember how many peole mentioned that Mike Penner did not make a terribly attractive woman.

Caitlyn has been universally -- well except for Chris Matthews -- proclaimed to be a beautiful woman.

Well, with surgery, a glam squad, great lighting, Annie Leibovitz, and some post production air brushing, any of us might make a striking woman. But, she's also set a high bar. She'll probably never look as good as she did on the cover of Vanity Fair.

It's already become a subject of discussion among other trans women online. Many don't believe her experience matches theirs, and there even seems to be some resentment about this.

I just hope Caitlyn is able to be comfortable in her own skin on her best days, and her worse.

 

Don't get me started. The franchise that Jim Brown and Otto Graham played for is now in Baltimore, dammit!