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Why are Asian-Americans so successful in America?

Discussion in 'Sports and News' started by YankeeFan, Oct 19, 2015.

  1. Mr. Sunshine

    Mr. Sunshine Well-Known Member

    As you know, that money is not intended to help. It's intended to sustain the dependence of a dependable voting bloc.
     
  2. The Big Ragu

    The Big Ragu Moderator Staff Member

    It depends what you mean by "austerity." If austerity means not doing every form of monetary manipulation it takes so debtors (whether they are sovereigns, individuals or corporations) can borrow "cheaply" to finance things they can't afford based on what they actually produce or earn (i.e. -- being forced to live within their means), the only people it "punishes" are debtors.

    The way the world has shifted since the late 1990s has created a [crumbling] version of the opposite of that -- that is on its last legs, for what it is worth. We are in the 9th inning of an unprecedented period of monetary manipulation that served to reward debtors (whether it is governments or individuals or any other entity that could borrow with no lending standards being enforced by actual price discovery in a free market). ... at the expense of those who actually tried to save in the face of forces trying to rob them of their savings (in real terms). It has created staggering debt levels.

    Forget the fact that REAL economic prosperity has always been predicated on the investment of savers. ... not an experiment of endless debt created by suppressing price discovery in the interest rate market.

    To my mind the fact that we are robbing savers to reward debtors is the real "punishment" that this has brought about by what I am talking about. It's grotesque. We have robbed savers of the income they saved for (People who delayed gratification to plan for their future), to the benefit of those who live beyond their means (and are enabled by central banks that are committed to inflating away their debt as much as possible for as long as possible).

    It also has created incredible instability because the debt levels this has brought about are beyond staggering -- whether it is government debt, student loan debt, mortgage debt, consumer debt, car loan debt (more than a trillion dollars and a subprime market that rivals the housing market in 2008), or margin debt that ends with speculation (the money is cheap, right?) and creates instability in our financial markets -- a la the derivatives meltdown in 2008 and much bigger meltdowns that are looming because of what we did to kick the can down the road rather than deal with the consequences. The outstanding private and public debt we have created in the last two decades will never be able to be paid back. It is incomprehensible that people don't get that SOMEONE is left holding that bag -- even if we have central banks working feverishly to keep the house of cards propped up by inflating away the real value of that debt for as long as they can, to hold off the defaults and a collapse of the bizarro world they have created.

    There has never been a happy ending to any story of overindebtedness, that I know of. In this case, it's particularly maddening, because it required suppression of price discovery in the interest rate market (interest rates are the cost of money -- and we have that cost being dictated by some appointed czars a la Soviet economics, rather than allowing all of us as a collective market to set that price) that was done in plain site of a blissfully ignorant public.

    Most people just don't seem to get it. But they do understand all the negative consequences of it that have hurt their own personal finances over the last decade. Until we have an outright debt and currency crisis that makes it impossible for the manipulation to go on--finally putting an end to the madness--those same people will continue to be easily seduced by others who run in with the typical simplistic "solutions" (because intentions are results!) that promise all kinds of stuff without any cost. Only in bizarro world does the arsonist also get to ride in and proclaim himself the firefighter, too. But that is what we are dealing with still.
     
  3. dixiehack

    dixiehack Well-Known Member

    Isn't it a good idea to keep freeways, airports, bridges, shipping docks, dams, etc. in sound shape regardless of how much or little you think the direct spending will goose the economy for a given year?
     
  4. doctorquant

    doctorquant Well-Known Member

    Your post makes me think of something I've long puzzled over.

    Suppose Joe and Jill make exactly the same amount of money and wind up paying exactly the same in taxes. After taxes Joe spends every last penny he has. Jill spends a lot, but not all, and what she doesn't spend she invests. Now, suppose that a year passes. Joe has only his regular income to pay taxes on, but Jill has to pay taxes on both her regular earnings and the earnings on her investment.

    Why is it so obvious to the "fairness" crowd that this is the way it should be?
     
    YankeeFan likes this.
  5. Ace

    Ace Well-Known Member

    You don't have to pay taxes on your investment if you leave them alone, though. Plus, Joe is paying all that sales tax!
     
  6. doctorquant

    doctorquant Well-Known Member

    Sure you do. You have to pay taxes on interest that's earned. You can also be taxed on capital gains made by your (non-retirement) mutual fund even if: 1) your mutual fund was a net loser in a given year; and 2) you never redeemed any shares.
     
    Ace likes this.
  7. Mr. Sunshine

    Mr. Sunshine Well-Known Member

    Great post.
     
  8. The Big Ragu

    The Big Ragu Moderator Staff Member

    Income is always taxed in this country -- name one dividend or amount of interest income (over a few bucks) you have ever received from an investment that didn't come with a 1099 at the end of the year.

    You are confusing income tax with a capital gains tax -- when you sell an asset for a gain and a tax is assessed on your profit. Indeed, that is only assessed when you make an actual sale (which creates a profit).

    It's a completely different issue, but the capital gains tax (which many want to raise) is a form of double taxation. If you are talking about stock you own in a company, for example, that money was already taxed at the corporate level when the earnings of that company (which created the appreciation in your stock) were taxed at an adjusted rate of 15 to 39 percent -- and which hits your bottom line as a partial owner of the company. However, you then get taxed all over again on any profit you make in the price appreciation of your stock if you choose to sell your equity to someone else.
     
    Last edited: Oct 26, 2015
  9. Dick Whitman

    Dick Whitman Well-Known Member

    I have a thought, and it's that maybe none of us - self included - are asking the right questions.

    As far as I can tell, the questions being tossed around are:

    • Why do success levels in the United States break so cleanly by race, i.e. why are East Asians and whites generally successful and blacks, Hispanics, and Native Americans generally not successful?
    • What can we do about it?
    But maybe we're skipping a very necessary preliminary question, which is:

    • Do we even care that success levels in the United States break cleanly by race? In other words, is it even a problem that needs fixing that black people are generally less successful than white people and Asians? Is it bothersome? Maybe it isn't.
     
  10. old_tony

    old_tony Well-Known Member

    Maybe a better question is this: If black people are lagging behind, what group of people should be held responsible for instituting the changes needed to help them catch up?
     
  11. Dick Whitman

    Dick Whitman Well-Known Member

    But I think that's just a sub-question of, "What can we do about it?"
     
  12. BTExpress

    BTExpress Well-Known Member

    Let's say Joe and Jill each made $50,000.

    Joe is paying taxes on $50,000.

    Jill, who invested $5,000 into a 401(k), is only paying taxes on $45,000 and will not be taxed on that other $5,000, nor any gains from that investment, until she retires (and her tax bracket will theoretically be lower). That's the way it's supposed to work, anyway.

    I suspect a great many people fear that whatever we "do" likely will mean them paying for it. And there's the rub.
     
    Last edited: Oct 26, 2015
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