"The Force Awakens" (with SPOILERS)

My problem with the supposed "conflict" is that at no point did he actually show conflict. All he did was say (repeatedly) how he felt drawn to the light but we never SEE that. It'd be like if Anakin only said "I feel drawn to the dark side" instead of showing the emotions of anger, jealousy and frustration that SHOW what that conflict is like.
Maybe I could buy it if he had let the captured people in that first scene live but by ordering them killed, he was pure bad guy. And at no other point did he say or do anything indicative of the good side.
So, to me at least, the "conflict" wasn't real, wasn't developed and his "wrestling with" emotions before killing daddy weren't relatable.
And we don't even know why he would want to be like his grandfather. At the least, he should have waxed poetic about WHY his grandfather was right all along and why the Jedis turned him the wrong way, etc. He could've gone off on the Republic during the scene with Rey at the very least.

 

I like the Ren character much more than Vadar as a villain. And his parents trying to "bring him back" really resonates.

Parents can "lose" their child to drug/alcohol abuse, a cult, a gang, whatever, and that is a very human feeling to still love your kid and hope he changes.

But now, you just want Ren to get what's coming to him. It's personal. It was never really personal with Vadar.

And though there may have been a lot of explaining of plot points, they did a good job of showing other things. For example, some of Finn's lies, Ren acting a brat with the light saber, etc.

 

Saw it today, and quoted a bunch of posts here but decided not to use them. A few thoughts:
It was very good. Probably would rank it behind eps IV and V.
My buddy thought Rey is Lukes daughter, but in my gut when Leia hugged her I thought that was the key. I think she's Han/Leias daughter.
Bb8 is amazing. To make a character like that convey real emotion is quite a talent, and it clearly plated off the performance of R2 in the originals. Loved the droid.
I didnt mind the parallels with A New Hope at all. The Starkiller was kind of lame, but it gave us more XWing action.
There were some emotional moments but Solos death wasn't one for me. I felt bad for Chewie but thats it. Loved Solos role and his scenes with Leia especially.

 

Quick question: Were X-Wing Fighters always equipped with lightspeed? Is hyperspace the same as lightspeed? I don't remember those things having long-range capabilities.

 

Not as far as I know. Technology!

 

So I was thinking more about this today and I think the most satisfying way they could develop the next two movies would be to do a complete and utter doubleswitch (Wrestling term) and have the second movie be all about Rey and Ren training in what you think is going to be the light and dark sides respectively but, instead, Rey gets cocky and embraces the dark side as the movie goes on while Ren really shows dimension and regret at killing his father and turns away from that path.
Then you get Rey making the ultimate conversion to evil by killing Skywalker while Ren suddenly finds himself as an outcast with no one to help him except his mother who brings him back from the brink and builds him up ahead of a final confrontation between the two in Episode IX.
I personally think this would be the most compelling story and the most original way to present the two characters but I doubt we'll get it. Looks like we're just going to follow the beaten path to a slightly mediocre trilogy with little to no surprises.

 

Schiezainc, I wish you were a Disney writer. I'd see those in a heartbeat. A lot better than a regurgitation of Episode IV!

 

My guess is Rey is the daughter of Pooja

Not a bad idea but I don't think Carrie Fisher is up physically to assuming the pivotal dramatic role, likely including a LOT of screen time and even some action scenes, in Ep. IX this would require.

 

Redeem the character that murdered Han Solo in that manner? I just can't see them going that route. I took that as Ren finally choosing his path, doing something so bad he could never turn back to the light.

I also don't see that in Rey, but that doesn't mean there can't be originality. People keep trying to stuff these characters into the roles from Episode IV, but it doesn't work quite as well as some think.

Poe Dameron may have some of Han Solo's recklessness and skill, but he wants to be a hero. There is no drama to be found in him making the heroic choice, as there was with Han at the end of Episode IV. He was never a self-centered scoundrel (to borrow a word I learned from Star Wars), so he doesn't have to make that journey.

Rey's circumstances mirror Luke's, but not her character. He desperately wants to leave home in spite of having a family to take care of him. He wants an adventure. Rey just wants to survive and stay on Jakku. She isn't looking for adventure. She is waiting on her family. She simply steps up when the circumstances push her that way.

Han Solo isn't exactly the same as Obi-Wan Kenobi, either. Obi-Wan had no interest in redeeming Vader. That idea wasn't even introduced until Luke said it in Return of the Jedi. At first, Han had given up on his son, but he went out of his way to try to bring Ben back. (By the way, I hope they deal with Leia feeling some guilt for talking Han into that. It cost the man she clearly still loves his life.)

Kylo Ren doesn't really fit with Darth Vader in Episode IV, either. Vader is a mature Sith Lord, more powerful than Ren and more in control. He shows no signs of being conflicted until late in the Empire Strikes back. Ren is going the opposite route. He is still battling with his path and seems to choose the darkness late in The Force Awakens.

Actually, the closest fit is BB-8 and R2-D2. They pretty much fulfill the same role and they do it the same way.

 

Yeah I'd put Ren at about the halfway point between Anakin and Vader. And it was a great moment, likely missed by some, when Leia felt Hans death.

 

Why J.J. Abrams Made "That" Kylo Ren Choice in 'Star Wars: The Force Awakens' - Spinoff Online - TV, Film, and Entertainment News Daily

This is all about the reasons why Ren kills Han.

Part of it is building up Ren as a villain. That was the one act that makes him worse than Vader, not just because he kills a beloved character, but because that character is his own father.

To me, that mirrored the moment when Vader decided to betray the Emperor and save his son, except Ren chooses the darkness rather than the light.

Of course, there is also the other reason Abrams stated for killing off Han, which was to give him a real purpose in the story. Apparently, the original plan was for Han to reconcile with Leia at the end of the movie, but they decided he needed a more important function. I do think the movie has a lot more impact because they went that route.

 

I agree with the reasoning but Solos death left no impact on me.