Trump cheats at golf - the ONE and ONLY politics thread

Not at all.

I do think it's worth asking what a candidate means when he/she says there should be a health of the mother exemption to bans on late term abortion.

 

She's definitely not for limiting what we have now. Do you think she favors mandatory abortions or something?

 

That's only around 7,000 or so ... damn near a rounding error.

 

There's some fairly time-consuming, middling research that indicates PTSD symptoms are prevalent more in late-term than early-term, but let's remember your argument: That antepartum depression could be so severe - but also sudden - that you wouldn't know it in an early trimester, and that an abortion would somehow cure it, magically.

There's a difference between "holy shit, I'm full of anxiety about having this baby" and "I am clinically depressed, the pregnancy has triggered it, and I may not live to through the pregnancy unless someone performs an abortion on me."

The latter is, frankly, an extraordinary postulate. I have rarely seen it uttered or used other than in a political, theoretical context, as in when a law is being fought.

I think the women's health exception, frankly, is an uncomfortable, curious middle ground. So is rape. I can make the psychological case for "this girl over here was raped by someone else 3 years ago, it altered the course of her sexual history, and this pregnancy is the implicit result of that rape" and probably make it stick, were I to cloak myself in a liberal's point of view. the minute I argue that it delegitimizes the rape exception, however, the argument would be tossed aside.

I support all attempts to limit abortion but, ultimately, either abortion is always OK or it's not OK. I've made this argument before: If a woman performance artist wanted to get pregnant, abort the baby, put it in a jar, and perform some ritual in art museums as performance art...what part of that wasn't her choice? If it's truly "hers," then it would include all matters of baffling and socially vile behaviors we could imagine, yes?

This is where the horror of abortion works for its legal status; we know the act is shameful, it has never been celebrated, and its shame keeps it chaste enough for people to simply ignore.

And I empathy for women. I do. And I can appreciate why Roe v. Wade came into being in the first place. It's simply inapt for civilization.

 

It seems like if the mother's life is endangered if she continues with the pregnancy, an abortion would be morally permissible under almost any belief system, no?

 

Study IDs reasons for late-term abortions

The researchers found that women in general delayed getting abortions if they are unsure they are pregnant, aren’t sure they want an abortion, and are disagreeing with the baby’s father.

Still, there were some differences in the two groups: The women seeking late-term abortions were more likely to be younger — ages 20-24 — than women who got earlier abortions, and the later-term patients waited far longer to confirm they were pregnant — they were often about 12 weeks gestation vs. five weeks gestation in the early-abortion group.

Most late-term abortions are, essentially, because the woman decided to finally have one, not because of a sudden, debilitating trigger of mental illness.

 

Dems: I don't even know why we're talking about this. Late term abortions are incredibly rare. Less than one percent. It's a fake issue. A total nothing burger.

Me: OK. So can we agree that the only exceptions to late term abortion bans would be in cases where the mother's life was in danger?

Dems: Noooo! That's completely unacceptable and extreme.

 

I was going to complain about like 20 pages of the most insipid political argument of all-time (the "try to prove the other side is hypocritical" game), but I realized nothing of interest is happening in either primary for awhile so carry on.

 

That's why. Things will crank up again next week. It's the All-Star Break right now.

I would like to remind everyone, however, that I don't have a "side," as I am currently engaging in a noble experiment of sitting this one out.

 

Trump's position on abortion dominated the news cycle over the last 36 hours.

People don't even know where Hillary stands on mental health exceptions to late term abortion bans, and aren't interested in learning her position.

That's odd to me.

Both Mother Jones and Politifact say she does support such an exception. I can't find her saying as much.

And, I think it is pretty clear that mental health exceptions make any ban meaningless.

So, support for a ban with such an exception gives a politician cover, but is meaningless.

 

Because mental illness isn't real.