Running racism in America thread

I found it interesting that you told me all about your experiences, some of the nuances and contradictions about your upbringing (and your life now), some of the things you think shaped you, the things you believe you benefited from, and the things you think you overcame.

But you talked about the black people you were comparing yourself to as a monolithic, racial. ... well, stereotype. It's as if they can't be individuals with their own unique experiences (the way you had your unique experiences that make you different from some other white guy), some that shaped each person as an individual positively, some that made it difficult as an individual to get ahead, with each individual person experiencing those things in their own unique ways and to differing degrees.

In any case, there are a lot of people in this country's history, and I am thinking of various immigrant groups, who faced bad schools, shitty neighborhoods, an unfair legal system, and no access to financial institutions because they were poor. They faced racism, discrimination and plenty of general assholry at the individual level. Even with the unfairnesses of life that you were pointing out (how I'd sum up a lot of what you said), a lot of people from circumstances like those have climbed the social latter in this country.

Today alone, if you look at census data, there are a lot of minority groups that out earn whites in this country. Forget about white immigrant groups. ... Nearly every Asian immigrant group, Pakistani Americans, Lebanese Americans and others. There are several BLACK immigrant groups, including Nigerians, Barbadians, Ghanaians and Trinidadians & Tobagonians, whose median household incomes are well above the average American household income.

I'd guess the major difference was that those are people who usually came her looking for opportunity. So even though life isn't fair, for them the opportunities here were much greater than the places they had left. And they were focused on taking advantage of the opportunities that were actually here for them.

Blacks in this country, who didn't immigrate here looking for opportunity? Forget slavery, which we are generations removed from now. ... just a generation ago, you had Jim Crow laws in a large part of the country.

You are not going to socially manage everyone's lives (nor should anyone want you to) to give everyone the same exact resources or circumstances in life or to undo the unfairness of the world. But since the civil rights movement (which was relatively recent by historical standards), America has made strides in getting rid of a lot of the systemicly racist things that were actually codified into law until relatively recently. That is what I want of my country with regard to the levelness of the playing field.

As a result, there is more of a flourishing black middle class than there was 30 years ago, and even more than there was 100 years ago.

I would like us as a country to continue to root out things that are systemically unfair to any racial minority, whether it's things about the justice system that treat some people differently or the discretion that police are given to bring their brand of shittiness into crappy neighborhoods where a lot of racial minorities live. But if we continue to make those kinds of strides, the opportunity is there for people. Life will still be unfair. A more level playing field won't necessarily mean that every single person has the same outcomes. But maybe we can all be individuals -- with different abilities and different ambitions, for whom there is enough opportunity that it's up to you to deal with your circumstances the way LOTS of people have, to achieve and be happy?

What we don't need? The identity politics, or more seperating people into racial groups with rhetoric that thinks that tearing down one group. or trying to lay a moral guilt trip on people because of something they didn't choose (you don't control your race), is somehow going to boost another group. ... To me, it's even worse with how that rhetoric has gained traction, because when it comes from white people, I find it particularly condescending. Black people aren't individuals with their own unique experiences, some of whom have had it rough in life, others who haven't. Listening to some people. ... they are all helpless victims.

 

Just to understand. ... The pool is open to everyone? As in, there is no policy that excludes people based on their skin color. ... and if I understood, in fact they opened up a mostly white township's pool to a lot of black people from another area because the pool in their area is closed?

Because if that is the case, that is not an example of systemic racism. Your anecdotes are examples of certain individuals' behavior. Those are neighbors of yours. ... Do you hold yourself responsible for their behavior since you (presumably) share the same skin color as them?

 

I think you are spot on about this. Attitudes have changed a lot in this country over my lifetime. The year before I was born, there was a case before the Supreme Court about a state law that banned interacial marriages. Today, I'm struck by how many interracial couples there are in TV ads. It was something you never saw when I was even in my teens. Interracial relationships (and marriages) have steadily risen since the 2010s. In a a few generations, everyone may look like a vague Asian, Puerto Rican mix. People will continue to find reasons to be cruel toward others, but the racism we know, because races traditionally stayed separated, may be selecting itself out fairly quickly.