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Muh Muh Muh My Corona (virus)

Discussion in 'Sports and News' started by Twirling Time, Jan 21, 2020.

  1. Baron Scicluna

    Baron Scicluna Well-Known Member

    Certainly. It's their money funding the plan. It's one of the advantages they have over fully-funded, which, as noted before, is required to pay out 80/85% of the money they take in. But, as the link shows, there's also a lot of potential disadvantages.
     
  2. doctorquant

    doctorquant Well-Known Member

    Any rationale for why self-insured are regulated differently? Or why there's a rule to begin with?

    If it's the latter, then it's because political actors do stupid shit, and are rewarded for it, all the time.

    If it's the former, I would assume it's some combination of: 1) the recognition that the accounting for what's administration/overhead in an outsourced administration scenario would be a nightmare; 2) many of the self-insured organizations are state governments or agencies (my employer, a big state university system, self-insures); or 3) the self-insured were able to get the exemption written into the law(s).

    Some might, but not all ... not even most. Delta (or some other big self-insured company) is no more vulnerable to "high losses due to extraordinary claims" than any big insurer.
     
  3. FileNotFound

    FileNotFound Well-Known Member

    We certainly have spent more time on this site exploring the “morality” of insurance today than the insurance industry has in the last 100 years.
     
  4. Scout

    Scout Well-Known Member

    If you self insure and you have more claims than expected, you are going to lose money than if you didn’t self insure.

    If you self insure and have fewer claims, your insurance budget will not be maxed out.

    I’m trying to understand how you don’t see that as a financial risk.
     
  5. The Big Ragu

    The Big Ragu Moderator Staff Member

    Insurance, as a business, offers people the ability to insure against a risk or risks of something occuring. The insurer assesses the risk of the event and charges a premium in return for assuming that risk.

    The morality issues surrounding that business should be no different than the morality issues surrounding anything else. Make a contract with someone for something, and if both sides live up to what they agreed to, it's a very moral exchange.

    My perception is that. ... because a lot of people have conflated people's health care costs with "insurance," and many seem to have an expectation of those costs being covered by someone or something, they then try to couch their expetactations in terms of the immorality of others.
     
  6. The Big Ragu

    The Big Ragu Moderator Staff Member

    If I run an insurance company and my actuarial tables fail me. ... as in I have claims that are greater than the premiums I took, I am going to lose money.

    There is no difference.

    Insurance companies face this all the time. For example, after really bad hurricanes.

    The financial risk is NO DIFFERENT. It's exactly the same.
     
  7. OscarMadison

    OscarMadison Well-Known Member

    Mazel tov, @Woody Long!

    @dixiehack, sorry to hear about your MIL. The number of breakout cases is probably higher than we've been told and I am sure we need to continue to be cautious, but the mitigation the vaccine offers outweighs it for me.

    The shrieking yahoos wear me out. Still not wishing they'd get COVID because they will take up clinical space other people need. and possibly spread it to those who cannot protect themselves right now.
     
  8. Inky_Wretch

    Inky_Wretch Well-Known Member

    These inmates are going to get PAID!

     
  9. Scout

    Scout Well-Known Member

    From the perspective of the client that chose to be self-insured, they did not expect to lose money.

    I guess you are looking at it from the insurance company standpoint, where I would look at it from local government, who probably employ about 5-7% of all the citizens of the locality. The locality does not have room in their budget for a bad insurance year. Large businesses I guess would take it out of profits so stock prices drop. Neither is a good scenario.
     
  10. Spartan Squad

    Spartan Squad Well-Known Member

    Fuck me. Shouldn't have jinxed it. We had our first student report a positive test. Waiting to see the shit storm that follows.
     
  11. The Big Ragu

    The Big Ragu Moderator Staff Member

    The actuarial risk of an event does not differ depending on who insures the event. It doesn't matter if it is Berkshire Hathaway, Delta Airlines or a government entity. I'm not looking at it from a "standpoint." Insuring something -- whoever takes on the risk of a claim -- means that you are assuming financial risk.

    I don't know who you consider "the client" in the first sentence of your post, but nobody self insures a health insurance benefit without knowing the actuarial risks.

    The risk isn't "losing money." It's all about trying to spend as little money as possible while operating your business. You are offering health insurance as a benefit to your employees. That is a cost. Your choices are to 1) pay someone (an insurer) who will assume the risk for a fee, or 2) if you have a large enough and diverse enough pool of people that you want to provide that benefit to, you might consider assuming the risk yourself. You then do the same exact thing that the insurance company you might pay to assume the risk does when they set their premiums. You use statistical methods to model the uncertainty of the events you are insuring, and come up with a cost that is commensurate with a level of risk that is relatively small. You "lose money" or incur a cost either way. Entities that self insure compare the cost at low actuarial risk to the cost a third party wants to charge (including their profit) to assume the risk. And they make a decision about how they are going to provide the benefit.
     
    Last edited: Aug 27, 2021
  12. Justin_Rice

    Justin_Rice Well-Known Member

    If you’re in a full ICU in Louisiana on a breathing machine and a hurricane knocks out power, do your freedoms keep the machine powered?
     
    HanSenSE and Inky_Wretch like this.
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