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Jordan Neely killing/Daniel Penny charges

Discussion in 'Sports and News' started by Alma, May 13, 2023.

  1. The Big Ragu

    The Big Ragu Moderator Staff Member

    I suspect there is going to be a defense argument of some sort that he didn't know it might / could kill someone. I don't know what they will come up with to that effect, but I strongly suspect it's going to be something like: 1) The U.S. government trained him in the maneuver, 2) They taught him that it's a way to disable someone, 3) They didn't teach that there is a significant risk of death involved.

    We all know that there is a significant risk of death, it's why police forces have banned chokeholds, but I totally wouldn't be surprised if the defense is going to try to put the blame on the marines / U.S. government, which apparently is still teaching chokeholds in basic training even after others have banned it.
     
    franticscribe likes this.
  2. Azrael

    Azrael Well-Known Member

    Last edited: May 13, 2023
    Alma likes this.
  3. The Big Ragu

    The Big Ragu Moderator Staff Member

    That story reads like a moral argument. It doesn't address the legal issue. He's going to be arguing that he wasn't reckless and taking an unjustifiable risk to human life (the element that would make it manslaughter). That story doesn't address precisely what the marines taught him about chokeholds and the risk of them causing death, which is what matters in the courtroom.

    We all know that chokeholds are dangerous. We know that the DOJ outlawed them two years ago for federal law enforcement agencies because they were too often leading to tragedy, and they said they are inherently dangerous. But that is precisely why I think that his defense will try to suggest that despite that knowledge, the marines still teach it as a way to subdue someone, not as a method of inflicting deadly force. Which if argued that way would be, "Neely couldn't have been acting recklessly based on what he knew. Blame it on the U.S. government / marines."
     
  4. Azrael

    Azrael Well-Known Member


    We'll see.

    https://www.marines.mil/News/News-D...co-c-recruits-learn-responsible-use-of-force/
     
  5. Inky_Wretch

    Inky_Wretch Well-Known Member

    Every single person taught a rear naked choke is told it will kill the victim if not released quickly. There is no way a Marine wouldn’t know that.
     
    Slacker likes this.
  6. Azrael

    Azrael Well-Known Member

    The Good Samaritan / Blame George Soros counternarrative has already built up quite a head of steam.




     
  7. doctorquant

    doctorquant Well-Known Member

    I for one am stunned that this became political.
     
  8. doctorquant

    doctorquant Well-Known Member

    And it's especially surprising that the "bad" people have decided to square off against the "good" people.
     
    Azrael likes this.
  9. Azrael

    Azrael Well-Known Member


    Locally anyway, those two groups are pretty tangled up.

    And the whole thing brings a lot of confusing and competing interests and approaches into conflict.

    Our mayor for example. Former cop, but also nominally a Democrat. Floods the subway with foot patrols.

    And this still happens. And his immediate response to it is kinda murky.

    Good guy? Or bad guy?
     
  10. MisterCreosote

    MisterCreosote Well-Known Member

    I’m stunned to see so many “conservative” “Christians” fundamentally misinterpret one of religion’s most well-known parables.
     
  11. doctorquant

    doctorquant Well-Known Member

    Don't forget "misunderstood."
     
  12. MisterCreosote

    MisterCreosote Well-Known Member

    Exactly. The video I saw is three minutes long and Neely is unconscious AND being choked out the whole time. And being “restrained” by two other donks on top of that.

    At no time in that video is anyone but Neely under imminent threat.
     
    Inky_Wretch likes this.
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