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Retirement?

Discussion in 'Anything goes' started by bstnmarthn354, Jan 2, 2017.

  1. poindexter

    poindexter Well-Known Member

    We may have had the same parents. In 1990, I was between roommates, and needed a place for three months until a place opened up. My dad made me pay rent. Absolutely reveled in it.
     
  2. MisterCreosote

    MisterCreosote Well-Known Member

  3. doctorquant

    doctorquant Well-Known Member

    OK, so I've been kind of stewing on this and this is as good a place as any to write through it. For me, the retirement question is not only a matter of dollars. There's the matter of familial obligations, both explicit and tacit ...

    My only sibling, a sister, is a couple of years younger than me. For most of her adult life, she's lived with/on my parents (my father's been gone for awhile now). She has some intellectual challenges, but they pale in comparison to her behavioral ones, namely her world-class self-centeredness, her abject laziness and her inability to not go nutso soon as some crummy guy takes an interest in her. She's had a few jobs over the years, but she always manages to piss those away by: A) almost immediately shacking up with whatever parolee they've let in the building; and then B) blowing off work the moment he takes a notion to go off on a multi-state "tour." That she hasn't been hauled in on some or another accessory charge is clearly evidence that God looks after fools.

    This latest stretch of her living with my mother goes back about eight years. My mother provides her with the use of one of the cars (which means car insurance), pays for a membership in the local YMCA, keeps her fed and clothed, gives her a modest monthly amount of pocket money ... and pays for her health insurance. Last year sissy-poo's health insurance was close to $6,000, and as she also had a little procedure, there was another chunk of out-of-pocket change (I think it was a couple thousand) that my mother coughed up as well.

    I don't really begrudge my mother doing with her money what she wants: If propping up sissy-poo floats your boat, have at it. She's reasonably comfortable -- it's cheap where she lives, the house is paid for, and she has some modest retirement savings. Thing is, my mother's 73, and she's begun to intimate that she expects me to keep things afloat after she passes. That ain't gonna happen. I am not spending my retirement years seeing after my sister. If that means that my mother leaves every dime to her, that's fine by me. Any familial obligations I'm going to honor will be toward my wife and children, not my sister.
     
  4. Ace

    Ace Well-Known Member

    So your sister is single, then?

    Yeah. I can see an obiligation to a sibling unable to care for himself/herself. But not for one who is unwilling and lost her enabler.
     
  5. doctorquant

    doctorquant Well-Known Member

    Divorced. Was married to this guy for four or five years, but one day I think he took a good long look and simply walked out the door.
     
    Ace likes this.
  6. MisterCreosote

    MisterCreosote Well-Known Member

    I have two of those in my family. I've lost track of what my parents have given them, but I know it's close to, if not more than, $100,000 overall.

    I'll help them out as much as I can, but only AFTER my wife and kids are taken care of. That's the best I can do. If they want/need more, that's their problem.
     
    Last edited: Jan 4, 2017
  7. Buck

    Buck Well-Known Member

    Don't get me started on this topic. Much too close to the bone.
     
  8. Bronco77

    Bronco77 Well-Known Member

    Without going into all the gory details, this is very similar to what my parents have gone through with my younger brother for the past 10 years. He can stay with them as long as he likes, and they've helped him financially, without getting a cent back in return. But there is a price to pay for all that -- he has been written out of the will. And mom and dad, who turned 80 a few years ago, have told me and my two sisters that while the decision is up to us, we are under no obligation to take care of him after they pass.
     
    Last edited: Jan 4, 2017
  9. The Big Ragu

    The Big Ragu Moderator Staff Member

    Not an issue with my siblings. I mean, if any of us needed the other and it was within our means to help, we would be there for each other no questions asked. But that is kind of predicated on the fact that we all take care of ourselves, and live our lives within our own means -- what we each earn for ourselves. It would take something extraordinary for any of us to be in the kind of need where we needed one another that way. If it came down to that, sure, we'd be there for each other without much thought. But in terms of the basics of earning a living, paying for our necessities, living within the means we have created for OURSELVES, etc.? No, none of us have any expectation that we are living our lives for anyone but ourselves.
     
  10. WriteThinking

    WriteThinking Well-Known Member

    You have to remember and realize that, despite appearances sometimes, not EVERYTHING gets posted on Facebook. What gets put on there tends to be new/different/changing/exciting, etc. to the poster. So, they might post that they got a new car. But it might be the first new car they've gotten in many years. That will be the case with me if/when I ever decide to post about a new car, because the one I'm driving is 16 years old and has 243,000 miles on it.

    Someone might post about the great vacation they're on, and appear to be "globe-trotting." But that might be the only special time off they take all year. That is/will tend to be the case with me after I say, go on a cruise. I've been on five of them in the past six years, on a Walmart subordinate salary. Because that's where I choose to spend my money. I treat myself well and generally do what I want and spend what I want (within the outer limits of reason) when I'm on the cruises -- even buying/collecting several expensive artworks over the last few years, thanks to an unexpectedly discovered interest/hobby that was a direct result of the cruising. And then, sure, it takes me part of the rest of the year to pay it all off. But I'm also very frugal, live a simple, budget-conscious life, usually pay with cash, and am generally smart with my money otherwise, and so, that is what has allowed me to travel more than anyone else in my family despite making significantly less than everyone else in terms of annual income, and keep my credit scores in the high 700s-800 range throughout my adult life.

    On the surface, I can afford very little. But I can do virtually anything I want, credit-wise, because I've handled my money well, and creditors know that I won't go beyond my manageable means, even though I do sometimes indulge in a few selected extravagances. That's all they see, and that's all that matters. In a different way, the same concept applies to what's posted on Facebook.
     
    dixiehack likes this.
  11. LongTimeListener

    LongTimeListener Well-Known Member

    This might be a cliche by now, it's an old book, but this is a quick and incredibly reassuring read:

    [​IMG]

    Two of the main themes are:

    1) The people driving fancy cars and living in fancy homes are never the truly wealthy people.

    2) Do not ever, no way, no how, give money to adult children.

    I will admit to a bit of wonderment (and possibly even envy, I'm human) at one family in particular that seemed to have it all, and showed it on FB with the vacation pics. Those pictures have slowed remarkably since the embezzlement sentence began.
     
  12. doctorquant

    doctorquant Well-Known Member

    To give you a sense of the kind of history my sister has (and this isn't the only instance of this kind) ...

    The winter of the year my son was born, when I was still doing my doctoral work and we all lived in the northwestern corner of South Carolina, my sister had gotten a job at a produce prep business, where they prep and "kit up" produce for local restaurants. For someone of her abilities and drive, it was a perfectly respectable gig. She lived with my parents, so a lot of her fundamentals were covered, but still, she was doing her part. Then one day she met this guy (we'll call him Jay) at work. Not a week went by before she and Jay were living together in a cheap hotel (she'd just kind of disappeared on my parents). My mother just had to get involved at that point, so she checked them into one of those budget suites hotel (with a kitchenette) so they wouldn't have to eat out all the time. They'd pay cash for the hotel on an ongoing basis, but this gave them a chance to maybe get out in front of things for a change. Then another couple of weeks went by, and suddenly the two of them up and quit the produce prep gig. My mother only found out when she called them at the hotel and learned they'd been checked out for a couple of days.

    A week or so passed -- with my mother frantic -- and out of the blue, my sister was on the phone, calling from Moorhead, Minn. Per her, she and Jay had headed up that way "looking for work" (never mind that they left jobs to do that) and needed money to get home. My mother stewed about it and then wired, I don't know, let's say $500. "We're on the way," they said. Another few days passed, with no sis and no Jay. The phone rang again, and this time they were somewhere in Arkansas because: A) they'd run into some bad weather; and B) sis wanted to see the Mississippi. At least that was their story. Again, my mother wired money, and again they were on the way. Of course by now you know that they were not shortly on the scene. From Arkansas they made their way to Orlando, and from there, they headed back to South Carolina, abandoning her car (bought by my parents, of course) at one of those giant truck stops along I-85. From there, they hitchhiked God knows where, winding up in some tiny little oil town along the Louisiana coast, where he worked out on a rig for a week or so to replenish their stores (she moved in with some family that rented rooms to transients).

    From the Louisiana stint, they hitchhiked north and west, ultimately finding themselves in a homeless shelter in Boise, Idaho. Apparently the living there was pretty good (it was a converted hotel, as I understand it), so they stayed put for a few weeks. One morning, however, they got in an argument, and he walked out. My sister IMMEDIATELY got on the phone to my mother, who promptly arranged a one-way ticket (you can imagine how expensive it was) for her to fly back home. My father refused to go to the airport (he'd washed his hands of my sister), but when my mother begged me to go with her, I went. We had a new baby (my son) at home, but back then my thought process still was "When your mother asks, you say yes."

    Now to this point, believe it or not, I've left out a couple of fairly juicy details. First, before they made that first dash to Minnesota, my sister and Jay, during the day, broke into my parents' house and stole, among other things, my mother's engagement and wedding rings (by this time my mother didn't wear her rings much). Second, as a farewell to the produce prep gig, Jay had broken into the building and stolen several hundred dollars in petty cash. And finally, when they were in Orlando, they somehow managed to use my mother's credit card number (off the receipt for that suites hotel she'd checked them into) to wire themselves a couple thousand dollars.

    When my sister came bouncing off that plane, a week before she'd turn 33, I was completely unaware of these juicy details. Even still, imagine my shock when her first words to me and my mother were: "Hey, what are y'all going to get me for my birthday?"
     
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