2013 Pro Football Hall of Fame Finalists

I don't know who would argue that they were the best receiving corps ever.

As for Rodgers in 2011, everything from the touch football era is suspect.

 

Torrey Holt is an almost certain Hall of Famer. Isaac Bruce has a borderline Hall of Fame case. Marshall Faulk is the best receiving running back of all time, easily.

Name a team with three better options.

 

And if you don't want to talk about the past decade, how about Steve Young in 1994 or Joe Montana in 1989? There needs to be a dome adjustment, along with another adjustment for the ridiculous receiving corps he had and another for the hurry-up style the Rams used to throw off defenses.

 

Yes. Certainly Joe Montana had no advantage by throwing only to Jerry Rice and John Taylor and Brent Jones and Roger Craig in 1989, nor did Young have an advantage with Rice/Taylor/Jones/Watters. I don't know how those guys ever survived. (In any side-by-side comparison, count Rice 2x when determining how good the whole group was.)

Not sure what bug you have about Kurt Warner but you are seriously underestimating how dominant he was. He let it fly downfield way more than either of the guys you mention and he still led the league in completion percentage.

Regarding his HOF merits ... there have only been 44 winners of the MVP award since it began in 1957. There have only been eight multiple winners. It's pretty difficult to see how a guy can be on that list of eight and not get in. Hell, being on the list of 44 should be enough to get you a good long look.

 

I have no issues with Kurt Warner, but I think his statistics were skewed by his system, teammates and stadium in a way that makes it really hard for me to put his Rams seasons against quarterbacks without such obvious advantages. Brett Favre's 1995 season would be above Warner's on my list, too.

 

So other than everything about the way he played the game, you're OK with Kurt Warner? Glad we were able to clear that up.
Plenty of players have gotten into the HOF because of the teams they were on and the teammates they had. Knocking one off for the same reason seems odd. Especially since a case can be made that those guys became hall of famers -- or at the very least, had their best seasons -- when Warner was throwing to them.

Funny that you brought up Steve Young, too, because their careers had similar arcs. A couple of extended periods as a backup, roughly the same length of time as an elite quarterback (5-7 years), one Super Bowl each, and eerily similar career stats (Young was slightly better, but they're very, very close).
Young was a first-ballot HOFer.
So why isn't Warner at least in the discussion?

 

Kurt Warner is going to be a very interesting debate. I'd be curious when the last time a modern era QB, who eventually got in, wasn't inducted on the first ballot... I'm almost positive Steve Young, Dan Marino, John Elway, Joe Montana, Jim Kelly, Warren Moon, Troy Aikman all went in on ther first ballot. All were deserving.

The arguments for Warner are obvious. One Super Bowl title, three Super Bowls total. Took two different franchises to the Super Bowl. He also spent quite a bit of his career as a backup. I can't wait for him to make the ballot.

 

The better Eli Manning does, the better Warner's chances will be. When he first retired, he was being knocked because he was benched for Marc Bulger, Eli Manning and then Matt Leinart during his career. Well, the situation in St. Louis was messed up beyond anyone's belief when Warner got canned. People now forget how much Leinart was considered a can't miss prospect out of college so it figured the Cardinals were going to give him some time to prove his worth.

However, if Manning becomes and HOFer, it shows that at least one benching was for a guy who became "the guy."

 

When did I say Kurt Warner isn't a Hall of Famer?

I disputed that his 1999 season was the second-best ever.

 

I agree with you there. I also will be startled, as in willing to bet a beer startled, if Warner doesn't walk in on the first ballot.

 

Mark Moseley agrees with this.

 

1. Manning is a Hall of Famer already. He's won two Super Bowl MVPs. He's in.
2. No one thinks of Warner in those terms. I have never heard that description ever in my life ever.
3. Even if they did, he still is a Hall of Famer.