enough about conflict of interest, let's see some APSE results!

[Moondoggy]

A few things jumped out at me in a random kind of scattershoot way:

In the investigative category, which I guess includes all circ classes, you saw Muncie, Birmingham and Albany in there along with the "big boys" like the NY Times and Daily News. Who says you have to be huge to investigate?

He gets some love on here from time to time, but I think John Canzano of the Oregonian is deserving to be mentioned among the elites on a regular basis. Peter Karasotis of Florida Today also seems to be showing up in awards lists quite a bit. What I've read of his, I've liked for the most part.

Didn't Tuscaloosa just change sports editors? Tough shoes to fill there - top 10 daily & Sunday. I also don't why I'm surprised (alarmed?) to see the Detroit News in the 100,000-250,000 grouping. I guess I just assumed it was in there with the big papers. Kudos for a top 10 daily finish though.

 

[printdust]

Reading this thread, I agree there might be a problem with the section judging. There shouldn't be 200 papers in one group and 34 in another. It should be evened out.

As for the individual writing awards. I don't think it's as big of a problem. As someone who's worked at a 5,000 daily, 55,000 daily and now 170,000 daily, I think people fail to remember the difference in amount of journalists papers have.

yes, in the 40,000 and under category there are 200 papers, but none of those papers have 10 people working in sports. I'd be willing to bet that most have 3 or fewer writers.

Now, there might only be 34 papers in the large section, but how many sports reporters does each one of those papers have? You're talking about papers who have 30 or more sports writers. Truthfully, for an individual award, you're competing against your co-workers' best stuff, too.

So maybe the answer is to change the current format for sections but keep the format for writing. Or maybe I'm way off.

I think we're all aware that those at the larger papers are in the major leagues compared to those on the bottom of the barrel. There are, however, a few good people at under 40s who for family or other reasons, just decided to plant there and grow and die there rather than climb the ladder.

As far as my spot in the world goes, I couldn't care less about awards- raises are desired, but that's as far as it goes. Getting a very real feedback on how you compare and what I can do to improve is welcome. And I appreciate the remark on comparative manpower in regards to graphic specialists, etc. If our paper got beat on graphics, special effect design work, etc., then I know our chances are pretty dim. If everything is, as another post determined, based on the best of the best as the measuring stick, same result.

 

[Football_Bat]

Shut out of the writing awards in an inbred 250+ division?

DMN opens a lemonade stand anyway.

http://www.dallasnews.com/sharedcontent/dws/spt/misc/weekend/stories/030208dnspoapse.36f3bf3.html

 

[JerryMicco]

Wow, I have not visited since Tuesday or Wednesday last in Orlando and this thread is unbelieveable. I won't even begin to tell folks how they can get involved with APSE, there are tons of ways. And you know what, you don't have to be a dues-paying member to attend any APSE function. Zero. No other organization does that. You can go to the regional whether or not you're a member. You have to pay the registration fee (It's $25 in the Atl. Coast convention in State College), but you do not have to be a member to get the benefit. So feel free to go and get some good, hands-on advice.

Let me say folks, that I've been involved with APSE since 1989 and have valued my time there. A lot of stuff comes up and a lot of stuff has changed for the better. We voted down the new contest categories. For the record, I chaired the committee with the changes and voted "no." Why? Because some papers made a very valid point that changing the contest would hurt them as much as papers who rarely, if ever, enter the contest. Fair enough. Maybe there's another way to skin this cat.

That doesn't mean we aren't going to look at this again. By Minneapolis, you're going to read about a likely motion to halve the U-40 section contest so the U-20s can get a separate judging, complete with plaques, etc. But we'd leave the writing categories the same. And the dues won't change. But, if you are a member for the contest only, then you probably should save the money. This organization is far more than that, or at least it should be to any sports journalist.

Since I'm one of the "old boy" network, you should know that I've run shops of 1.5 staffers and shops of 46 staffers. I now have low 30s in Pittsburgh (circ. 213,000 and we didn't play up. OK, call me a wuss). Won some awards in the past and come away with nothing some years. But trust me, it means nothing who you are, but what you do. It kills me to read what some posters are saying. Goodness, if you feel that strongly about a situation, every officer's email is on the APSE page. Take the time to occasionally visit it and let your feelings be known. But the crap I see printed here about APSE and folks who are members is just poor. Especially if you're not posting without your name. Sorry, but that's just weak.

Critiques? Celeste Williams chairs a critique committee within APSE. It's on the Web site. Send her a note and a couple sections for a critique. heck, I'm not even a member of the committee but if you want a critique, Christ, send it to me. I'm willing to offer an opinion to anyone who wants it. My email is jmicco@post-gazette.com.

Bottom line folks is this: It's far from a perfect organization, but it does a lot of good in a lot of ways. And I've never met a group of folks who is willing to help out other editors more than this one. When I was in Lynchburg, Va., in the mid 80s, Jim Smith, then Sunday editor of the AJC, met me at a regional and after that, would critique sections I'd send him occasionally. I can't tell you what that meant to me. And I was not an APSE member back then, but I went to the regionals.

Folks, there's advice out there if you want it. If not, that's fine, it's your shop and your call. There are talented folks at U-40s and at 250-up. If we can possibly work together to make APSE stronger, let's do that. If you don't want to do that, then it's probably better if you save the $95.

Sorry for the long post.

 

[joe king]

As it concerns under 40K (and, actually, any of the divisions): Don't confuse number of entries/entrants with quality of competition. In my experience with judging, yes, there are fewer entries in the over 250K, but each entry is lights-out. Seriously good material. Also, in my experience, the same can't be said about the under-40. Yes, there are more entries in the under-40K, but half (and this year, more than that) could be tossed almost immediately. Just keeping it real here.

Second, going to an earlier point someone made, it's not the over 250s who are afraid of the competition. It's the slender group of 175-250 who don't want to go against the over 250s. Let's be crystal clear on that point. In every single one of the proposed new divisions, it's the smaller papers that would be bumped up who are complaining the most.

And for the record, I have no dog in this hunt. My paper is neither over 250 or under 40 and would not have been affected by any of the changes.

Wait a minute, we've got a former MLB shortstop judging and we're worried about Jim Jenks?

 

[friend of a friend]

For the record, I chaired the committee with the changes and voted "no." Why? Because some papers made a very valid point that changing the contest would hurt them as much as papers who rarely, if ever, enter the contest. Fair enough. Maybe there's another way to skin this cat.


--------------

Does this make sense to anyone?

 

[Frank_Ridgeway]

shirt, Jerry. We have Jim telling us this:

Frank: The contest is for us and by us. Us being the members of APSE.

And we have you basically saying APSE is for all of us. I like your way better, but whether it's for all of us or not is beside the point. As long as it purports to represent all of us -- with or without our consent, I might add -- all of us have the right to criticize it.

As for this ...

But the crap I see printed here about APSE and folks who are members is just poor. Especially if you're not posting without your name. Sorry, but that's just weak.

... either the points made here and the questions asked here are valid or they are not. Unless your goal is just to get us to shut up. The anonymity thing is important beyond the freedom to be more critical. It allows us to praise good work without being thought a suckup on the prowl. And it allows all input to be judged on its own merit rather than the professional pecking order that occurs, well, that occurs in journalism organizations.

 

[FreddiePatek]

As it concerns under 40K (and, actually, any of the divisions): Don't confuse number of entries/entrants with quality of competition. In my experience with judging, yes, there are fewer entries in the over 250K, but each entry is lights-out. Seriously good material. Also, in my experience, the same can't be said about the under-40. Yes, there are more entries in the under-40K, but half (and this year, more than that) could be tossed almost immediately. Just keeping it real here.

Second, going to an earlier point someone made, it's not the over 250s who are afraid of the competition. It's the slender group of 175-250 who don't want to go against the over 250s. Let's be crystal clear on that point. In every single one of the proposed new divisions, it's the smaller papers that would be bumped up who are complaining the most.

And for the record, I have no dog in this hunt. My paper is neither over 250 or under 40 and would not have been affected by any of the changes.

Wait a minute, we've got a former MLB shortstop judging and we're worried about Jim Jenks?

I resemble that remark! Damn, just got caught stealing again ...

 

[JayFarrar]

I'm a little scared for Frank's health.
He is very full of anger. Please drink some buttermilk, it keeps the ulcers from forming.

 

[GBNF]

Any idea how the next phase of the judging works? Or is the judging over, and they wait until June to announce the winners?

 

[Pulitzer Wannabe]

Any idea how the next phase of the judging works? Or is the judging over, and they wait until June to announce the winners?

I believe that they bring in the media relations directors from each Major League Baseball club and they work to rank the entries.

 

[GBNF]

Any idea how the next phase of the judging works? Or is the judging over, and they wait until June to announce the winners?

I believe that they bring in the media relations directors from each Major League Baseball club and they work to rank the entries.

Come on man, don't be a douchebag. I asked an honest question. Why bring that shirt up again? Let it go.