Running gun violence thread

[RickStain]

I absolutely believe in burden of proof.

But the burden of proof for an accusation is pretty low.

 

[cranberry]

I'm keeping an open mind but I'll be especially interested to hear why the officer didn't believe he could chase down and apprehend a wounded, unarmed, 300-pound suspect.

 

[Dick Whitman]

The very best way to refute the accusation that this was "cold-blooded murder" is for the police to release their incident report and evidence showing it was justified.

They haven't done so. Too forking bad.

Not the officer in question's decision.

Accuse the cops of not releasing information.

Don't accuse a cop of execution.

Why not?

We have witnesses who say it was an execution.

We have the people in charge of the investigation that could disprove that theory acting as if they are covering something up.

That's more than enough to justify an accusation.

We have witnesses, and an autopsy report, that dispute the witnesses who claim this was an execution.

How does the autopsy report dispute that claim?

 

[Dick Whitman]

Don't accuse a cop of execution.

Maybe in the first two or three days afterward.

The police have had nine days to get their shirt together and clear Wilson's name.

They've chosen to not do so. Too forking bad.

Exactly.

It must be nice to be able to just bide your sweet time to put together a report on one of your own.

 

[Dick Whitman]

"Bring it, you forking animals. Bring it."

I can't imagine why these demonstrations continue.

 

[Morris816]

The bottom line is this: Yes, Brown committed robbery. Yes, I believe he is not entirely innocent with regards to the confrontation. Yes, the looters need to be held accountable.

But let's quit kidding ourselves into thinking the police don't deserve the larger share of the blame. The way they have been handling the case is comical. They're doing a sloppy job of getting information out. They're taking too long to get reports done. They aren't saying a single thing that indicates they want to build trust with the public. And their first instinct to any sort of protest, peaceful or otherwise, is to show up in riot gear, immediately leaving the impression that they aren't police, but an invading army.

And, of course, the response to all the looting and other illegal activities is MORE INVADING ARMY TACTICS.

It's time for a lot of people -- ranging from the police chief to the governor -- to start admitting that they have forked things up since day one and to start apologizing, not for what happened to Brown, but for their response to what happened. That's the only thing, at this point, that I see that might calm people down.

Because it's quite clear that no civilian in Ferguson will trust anybody who works in law enforcement or serves in the armed forces until they are given an actual reason to do so.

 

[Morris816]

"Bring it, you forking animals. Bring it."

I can't imagine why these demonstrations continue.

There's that, too.

Showing up in riot gear and issuing threats pretty much guarantees hostility. All you need now is for an officer to claim he thought he heard somebody yell "fire!"

 

[BenPoquette]

The bottom line is this: Yes, Brown committed robbery. Yes, I believe he is not entirely innocent with regards to the confrontation. Yes, the looters need to be held accountable.

But let's quit kidding ourselves into thinking the police don't deserve the larger share of the blame. The way they have been handling the case is comical. They're doing a sloppy job of getting information out. They're taking too long to get reports done. They aren't saying a single thing that indicates they want to build trust with the public. And their first instinct to any sort of protest, peaceful or otherwise, is to show up in riot gear, immediately leaving the impression that they aren't police, but an invading army.

And, of course, the response to all the looting and other illegal activities is MORE INVADING ARMY TACTICS.

It's time for a lot of people -- ranging from the police chief to the governor -- to start admitting that they have forked things up since day one and to start apologizing, not for what happened to Brown, but for their response to what happened. That's the only thing, at this point, that I see that might calm people down.

Because it's quite clear that no civilian in Ferguson will trust anybody who works in law enforcement or serves in the armed forces until they are given an actual reason to do so.

This I can agree with. The Cops' decision to close ranks and "protect a member of the brotherhood' has just made things worse...as has the presence of Al Sharpton, Jesse Jackson, etc. If the police department cannot see how emotional this thing has been from Day One they either are incompetent, blind or stupid. I don't care if the kid was the biggest thug in the world...the reaction from the police department has been shameful.

 

[Mr. Sunshine]

Don't accuse a cop of execution.

Maybe in the first two or three days afterward.

The police have had nine days to get their shirt together and clear Wilson's name.

They've chosen to not do so. Too forking bad.

#journalism

 

[Dick Whitman]

The bottom line is this: Yes, Brown committed robbery. Yes, I believe he is not entirely innocent with regards to the confrontation. Yes, the looters need to be held accountable.

But let's quit kidding ourselves into thinking the police don't deserve the larger share of the blame. The way they have been handling the case is comical. They're doing a sloppy job of getting information out. They're taking too long to get reports done. They aren't saying a single thing that indicates they want to build trust with the public. And their first instinct to any sort of protest, peaceful or otherwise, is to show up in riot gear, immediately leaving the impression that they aren't police, but an invading army.

And, of course, the response to all the looting and other illegal activities is MORE INVADING ARMY TACTICS.

It's time for a lot of people -- ranging from the police chief to the governor -- to start admitting that they have forked things up since day one and to start apologizing, not for what happened to Brown, but for their response to what happened. That's the only thing, at this point, that I see that might calm people down.

Because it's quite clear that no civilian in Ferguson will trust anybody who works in law enforcement or serves in the armed forces until they are given an actual reason to do so.

This I can agree with. The Cops' decision to close ranks and "protect a member of the brotherhood' has just made things worse...as has the presence of Al Sharpton, Jesse Jackson, etc. If the police department cannot see how emotional this thing has been from Day One they either are incompetent, blind or stupid. I don't care if the kid was the biggest thug in the world...the reaction from the police department has been shameful.

Here's a piece from November about what a great job police do investigating their own:

http://www.nytimes.com/projects/2013/two-gunshots/

 

[qtlaw]

Yeah, you would think that the family lawyer, paid by said family, would pin the blame 100 percent on Brown. Crazy turn of events, and extremely relevant.

Officer of the court.

Lawyers are supposed to seek the truth.

Crump isn't defending Michael Brown in court.

Accusing someone of execution is irresponsible for a member of the bar.

Sorry, that's simply wrong.

A lawyer is supposed to fight for their client's interests to the fullest extent of the law.

The lawyer is an advocate for the client; NOT the trier of fact; that's the duty of the judge and/or the jury.

The lawyer takes positions, whether in court or in public.

As an officer of the court, the lawyer has a duty to not make knowing misrepresentations or omissions to THE COURT.

The Brown attorney is fanning the flames, no doubt, but he has done nothing wrong in taking a position based on the autopsy.

Its up to the public to decide whether to believe him or not.

 

[heyabbott]

The bottom line is this: Yes, Brown committed robbery. Yes, I believe he is not entirely innocent with regards to the confrontation. Yes, the looters need to be held accountable.

But let's quit kidding ourselves into thinking the police don't deserve the larger share of the blame. The way they have been handling the case is comical. They're doing a sloppy job of getting information out. They're taking too long to get reports done. They aren't saying a single thing that indicates they want to build trust with the public. And their first instinct to any sort of protest, peaceful or otherwise, is to show up in riot gear, immediately leaving the impression that they aren't police, but an invading army.

And, of course, the response to all the looting and other illegal activities is MORE INVADING ARMY TACTICS.

It's time for a lot of people -- ranging from the police chief to the governor -- to start admitting that they have forked things up since day one and to start apologizing, not for what happened to Brown, but for their response to what happened. That's the only thing, at this point, that I see that might calm people down.

Because it's quite clear that no civilian in Ferguson will trust anybody who works in law enforcement or serves in the armed forces until they are given an actual reason to do so.

i mostly agree with this.

Did the riot and looting occur before or after the paramilitary police showed up? Why riot? Why steal from your neighbors and burn your own community?
Why initially portray the victim as something he was not?

There are no winners, but the truth loses.