2011-12 Hot Stove Thread

Re: 2011 Hot Stove Thread

Cubs fans are hoping he's the next great shortstop.

Who knew he may also turn out to be the next Kobe Bryant and Ben Roethlisberger:

 

Re: 2011 Hot Stove Thread

At this stage, he IS the next Kobe Bryant and Ben Roethlisberger. None of them was ever convicted of rape in a court of law.

So welcome to the outcast court of public opinion, Starfucker.

 

Re: 2011 Hot Stove Thread

IIRC, the Padres have a new GM, and Rizzo failed in a brief audition at 1B last year. It still seems way too early to trade him for a back-end rotation or good relief prospect to me, but if you think Yonder can do the job better, probably best to move him now before you get to spring training and it becomes apparent to other teams. (Loss of bargaining position and what not.)

 

Re: 2011 Hot Stove Thread

They do. It's Josh Byrnes, who used to be at Arizona.

And of course, Theo Epstein drafted Rizzo for the Red Sox.

 

Re: 2011 Hot Stove Thread

It was already pretty clear that Alonso was going to start the season in the majors and Rizzo would be at AAA. That shouldn't diminish his value that much. This idea that a prospect becomes less valaubl;e because a team has more than one at the same position is silly.

 

Re: 2011 Hot Stove Thread

Why is that silly? Sure, you still have other teams that you're competing against for a player, but as long as Team X has two guys who can only play that one position, the one that isn't playing is going to diminish in value.

In Rizzo's case, he's probably young enough that it didn't matter that much, but the haul for him still seems pretty light. He's gone from the cornerstone of the A-Gonz deal with Casey Kelly to more of a challenge trade here with the Cubs, prospect for prospect.

 

Re: 2011 Hot Stove Thread

The main reason it is silly is because Rizzo's primary value is long term, not just 2011. Hell, it's not like Alonso is a sure thing or that Rizzo has been blocked for years. There is no reason to rush to deal him for lesser value.

 

Re: 2011 Hot Stove Thread

You can make those arguments, sure, but if I'm the other team, my retort is, "Well you have no place to play him anyway. Trade him to me for 80 cents on the dollar, or you can wait a year, and someone else will give you 50 cents on the dollar." If Yonder isn't the real deal, then he's the one that loses all the value.

Regardless, you have two commodities, and the longer you keep them both on your roster, the more bargaining power you lose. Maybe you can get away with it if Rizzo goes nuclear in Triple A again, but I think the value of slugging 1B prospects is lower than that of any players to begin with, since there seems to be a high fail rate. (If they don't hit, it's not like you can turn them into a utility player; most are already at the end of the defensive spectrum.)

 

Re: 2011 Hot Stove Thread

You are making it sound like they just inherited Yonder. If they were happy with Rizzo, they should have made a different deal for Latos, and if that trade devalued Rizzo they should be blamed for it.

 

Re: 2011 Hot Stove Thread

That's my point. Rizzo is the exact same player today that he was before they made that trade. He has the same resume and skills. His value did not go down. Or up. It stayed the same. If the Padres accepted less in trade because of some perceived loss of value, they were stupid.