2012 Pro Wrestling Thread

I'm guessing the idea is that Cena has never been able to live up to the icons of the past in the WWE, never been able to earn that level of respect from the fans and he had his chance here and blew it. That should motivate him and force him to question how good he really is, question his real place in WWE history.

But I think I'm giving the WWE's writing staff too much credit. We're probably going to see him come out tomorrow and say "Oops. Oh, well. I'm going to beat CM Punk for the title now."

 

For the most part, my thoughts are in line with the rest of the board on WrestleMania: Disappointed with the Sheamus-Bryan match, satisfied with most of the middle of the card, totally enthralled with Taker and Trips, in love with Punk and Jericho, and more than satisfied with Rock and Cena. Though I didn't post predictions here, I did over on Facebook, and I picked Rock. Think I was the only one. I just didn't see how Rock would lose in Miami, especially with the reported fan reaction in Miami all week, and a Cena loss sets the table for an eventual heel turn. Not sure when (Monday would be spectacular), but his failed attempt at a People's Elbow at the end of the match -- that action, that face, that little shrug at the end belying storyline arrogance -- set it up pretty well.

A few other quick thoughts and facts:

-- At an official time of 18 seconds, Sheamus-Bryan is the second-shortest match in WrestleMania history, behind only Kane-Chavo Guerrero for the ECW Championship at Mania 24, which lasted eight seconds. (The official time for King Kong Bundy-S.D. Jones at the first Mania had long been touted as nine seconds, but when I checked tonight on Wikipedia, I found it listed at 24 seconds. Hm.)

-- Ten of the 299 matches in Mania history have lasted less than a minute. Surprisingly, four of them have been title matches (Hogan-Yokozuna at Mania 9, Kane-Guerrero at Mania 24, and Rey Mysterio-JBL for the IC belt at Mania 25 were the others).

-- This was the first Mania to feature two matches of 30 or more minutes, and the first Mania to feature three matches of 22 or more minutes. For what it's worth, excluding the tag championship match, which still has an unknown listed time, this Mania also had the second-longest average match time (14:43, behind only the 17:14 average time at Mania 12, which featured the Michaels-Hart Ironman match). Really, just take that for what it's worth, which probably isn't much.

Fun show. I watched at a packed sports bar outside Orlando. I showed up at 6:40 and they told me they had already stopped taking names for tables, so I just stood and watched for four hours. I bought a Coke. This crowd was incredible, better than some TV crowds I've seen. Every TV in the place, about 30 in all, was showing Mania, and everybody was into everything. The cheering built throughout the night, right up to Rock-Cena. The place chanted back and forth -- "Let's go Cena/Cena sucks," "Rocky," general shrieks from 10-year-old girls (two of whom were right next to me). It was a lot of fun. There were a bunch of kids, which was actually nice to see. A couple a few tables over brought their baby, couldn't have been more than four months old. Near the end of the show, I joked with her that they should have picked up a "My First WrestleMania" Onesie. The Mom said she had been looking for one. I was floored. Wish I could have watched this one with my group back home, but I had a lot of fun with this crowd.

 

I thought it was a damn fine card. I'm much happier overall than I was last year. I got 6 out of 9 of my picks right (missing on victories by Cena, Rhodes and Orton), but here's a rundown of what I thought of the night's festivities ...

Sheamus vs. Bryan: At this point, the E is wiping its ass with the WHC. Just end the brand extension (especially since there is one GM now) and have a title unification match. Soon. This was a goddamn joke. Unless Bryan or Sheamus was hurt and couldn't compete, but they looked fine to me.

Orton vs. Kane: A solid match, considering there was no build-up. Neither man's fault, as I'm sure Orton's plans were ruined by Barrett's elbow dislocation. Surprised Kane went over, though.

Rhodes vs. Big Show: Uh, another surprise. Why put over a veteran face who doesn't need the rub? Taking out the Big Show is another notch in the belt for the rising young blood. Hell, Rey did the job for Rhodes last year at WM27. This guy could be a future main eventer. Not a smart move to have him job the belt. Could have dropped it at a later PPV to another young talent, allowing Rhodes to move to the WHC.

Undertaker vs. Triple H: Match of the night, from a storytelling point of view. While the guys are getting broken down and can't work like they could in 2001, they can still tell a story. Hell in a Cell and HBK were nice additions and didn't detract from the main theme: End of an Era. It really has felt that way in the past 5 years. The de facto retirement of Flair, HBK, the extremely reduced schedules of Hunter and Taker, the abrupt retirement of Edge last year. Lots of rumors flying around. What will happen? Is Taker done? Does Hunter lure HBK out of retirement to retire him? Who knows?

Divas: Who gives a shit?

Team Laurenatis vs. Team Long: Predictible, and a waste of some talent. Especially Ziggler. The verbal burying of Swagger continues, as Lawler points out, "What has he ever done at WrestleMania?" Well, he won MitB a few years back and cashed it in on Jericho for a WHC, a reign which was embarassing even as a transitional reign. What does Johnny Ace do with two shows? For the love of God, end brand extension and unify what's left of the titles. The WHC is a joke, and no one remembers that Santino Fucking Marella is the US Champion. Could have been a bit more exciting as an elimination match. That way, you quickly dump all the dead weight and get down to an exciting one-on-one match with Ryder and Ziggler or Ryder and Miz, who could have delivered something more respectable.

Punk vs. Jericho: Match of the Night, from a technical point of view. These guys know how to work. Didn't seem like the crowd was that into it. Seems like no one's been into Jericho's return, but perhaps because everyone wanted a face return. We're tired of heel Jericho. He's stale now. Great submission wrestling, and so glad my boy Punk came out on top. That's how you use a veteran to put the young talent over. Thank you, Jericho. It's why you'll be one of the greats, no matter what your character is.

Rock vs. Cena: Hey, kids! Check out my new GREEN shirt! At the merchandise stand now or at WWEshop.com! It's the latest in the Cena Fruity Pebbles line! The entrances were meh, but great if you like that kind of music. I guess. They took way too long. The match did what it needed to do: paint both men as being at the top of their craft, but one had to win. I'm surprised Cena didn't go over, but VKM has always had a hardon for The Dwayne. I guess a win was needed to stroke The Dwayne's ego so he keeps popping up every so often. After all, with Trips and Taker done and Austin not wanting to risk neck injury, Rocky is all that's left of the Attitude Era greats. For the crowd, Rock's victory was the right call. Cena could have killed Osama bin Laden himself, and still be booed out of the Rock's hometown. I did like the arrogance shown near the end, with Cena trying to do the People's Elbow with his Wonder Woman arm band. Technically, it was sound but nothing special. They did their signature moves, kicked out of finishers and kept the crowd in it.

So, where does Cena go from here? Back to winning his 5,387th WWE Championship while Punk is kicked back to the midcard, knowing The E. After all, there are new T-shirts to sell.

 

Tonight's main event looks awful -- a 10-man tag with Cena, Punk, Orton, Show and Sheamus vs Henry, Bryan, Rhodes, Jericho and Kane.

I was hoping for a a long Sheamus-Bryan rematch since they're fresh.

 

Just a quick chime in.

Thought the card was great.

And that MGK or whomever he is, looked like an end-stage AIDS patient. Smmfh!

Ugh!

At least Rock won.

 

I think that might be the post-show "main event", because they announced it at the Hall of Fame ceremony on Saturday. I'm sure the TV main will be some contrivance at the request of the Executive Vice President In Charge Of Talent Relations And Interim General Manager of Raw, Mr. John Laurinaitis.

 

Also I'll tally up the score for our contest. Stupid Dave Meltzer didn't assign star ratings to his WM recap last night, but he definitely said Taker-HHH was the best match of the show, and that seems to be the consensus (Punk-Jericho and Cena-Rock had too many slow spots).

 

Really funny they talked so much about the "end of an era" when they did nothing but pimp the old guys.

Of the young talent, who really got a decent rub from this besides Punk?

Rhodes lost clean. Sheamus and Bryan got crapped on. Miz won but there was nothing clean about it. Cena loses clean. Hell, even Orton lost clean. I get that Mania is a time for the "legends" to make their mark but they've already done that. At minimum, you have to at least give the few matches where you have two or more young talents working an opportunity to make their names. That's why the Bryan-Sheamus thing is so disappointing to me.

 

Just a quick, probably unfair thought from reading reaction all over the web:

Smarks will *never* be happy. They just won't. Being unhappy with the WWE is their defining trait as a fan, and that's what they are going to be.

Other than some extended American Dragon to drool over, they've gotten *everything* they insist that WWE doesn't do:

Cena lost cleanly. CM Punk is still the WWE champion and closing in on a six-month run, and he won in a fairly technical match with a clean, submission ending to another smark favorite. Daniel Bryan isn't WHC anymore, but he lost it to an up-and-coming star and not an aging HHH or one of his friends. There were tons of swerves. The big matches were long and given plenty of time to breathe.

 

My thoughts...
Overall, it was a solid show. My measuring stick for buying a PPV is to have one or two matches I really want to see. If they deliver, I've gotten my money's worth and if there's a third that's good I'm happy. I was happy with this show. Taker-Trips was great (and I appreciated it more watching it the second time on the replay), Punk-Jericho was great and Rock-Cena was good enough.
The crowd was also great, which helped immeasurably. It was a huge improvement over last year's shitfest in Atlanta, where the matches were mediocre and the fans were checking their Blackberrys the whole time.
The biggest problem I saw was it seemed like they overbooked by one match. They could've easily folded Kane and Orton into the 12-man tag and opened up some time for Sheamus-Bryan. As it was, they almost ran out of time at the end of Rock-Cena.
Other thoughts...

Sheamus-Bryan: Maybe the biggest controversy of the night, along with Rock winning, but the more I think about it the more I kind of like it. Yeah, these guys deserved better and certainly could've put on a great show.
On the plus side, it was unexpected and can definitely kick off a multi-PPV feud by being a squash without being a squash. Bryan got caught, he wasn't pummeled for three minutes and pinned. He can spin it to where he comes out without looking like a chump, by blaming AJ or just using the "caught off guard" excuse. Honestly, I'd rather them do it like this than have what feels like an abbreviated 7-minute match.

Kane-Orton: Another surprise, with Kane winning, but this is exactly what I was hoping for. A solid, physical match between two veterans. Nothing super special, but it wasn't terrible.

Big Show-Rhodes: The biggest disappointment of the night, for me. I was looking forward to this match and these guys underwhelmed. I don't have a huge problem with Big Show winning, and it was nice to see his genuine emotion afterward. The performance of he and Rhodes just seemed off, though. I thought this could be a hidden gem on the card, and it ended up being pretty forgettable.

Divas: I folded laundry during this match. What I saw of it, there were a couple things that stood out. Kelly Kelly's flip off the turnbuckle onto Beth was a sweet move. And I'll give Menounos credit for not being a wrestler and working a couple long stretches of the match with what's apparently a legitimate and painful injury. She didn't look out of place in the ring, either, which is more than you can say of most WM celebrity matches.

Taker-HHH: Wow. Just ... wow. This match was brutal. Neither guy held back on the physicality, whether it was the stiff chairshots or their regular moves, and they're going to have the bruises and scars to prove it. I don't think Taker was selling too much when he was staggering out of the ring, nor was Triple H when he was helped out.
Great production work really lifted this match to another level. JR always adds something to a match. But the camera and mic work was awesome. The close-up shots early (the action outside the cage, Taker's leg drop on the apron) made you FEEL the impact of this match. As it went on, you got the shots of Triple H's busted-open eyebrow and Taker's bruised back, plus the great reaction shots on the kickouts. Then you throw in the sound guys picking up the conversations between Triple H and HBK, and Taker and HBK, and that added another layer to the drama. Like I said in an earlier post, the production team had as much to do with making this an all-time classic as the guys in the ring.
I also think it was the last match for both Undertaker and Triple H, based on the post-match sequence. Undertaker looked around like he was soaking in the moment one last time. Triple H had that Flair/HBK moment where he knew he had given all he could give and it was his time to exit. The whisper HBK and Taker exchanged, with HBK giving the comforting pat on the back. The group hug on the ramp.
I honestly think both guys can go out on that high note, and have absolutely no regrets. This was the grand finale. It was not the next chapter in the story.

12-man Tag: Utterly forgettable, except for Eve kicking Ryder in the broskis.

Punk-Jericho Another great match. Only problem was it fell victim to its expectations. Everyone was thinking a 5-star epic, and we got a great 4-star match so it feels a little flat. Good storytelling, more great production work with the mics picking up Jericho's taunts and Punk telling Jericho to "submit, you son of a bitch!"
The finishing sequence was incredible. Any time you get the suspension of disbelief in a match it adds to it, and I could've honestly seen this ending with one of those small packages.
I also loved the subtle psychology of the ending, which played into the "best in the world" theme. Jericho escaped the Anaconda Vice once by kneeing Punk in the head. Great move. Punk locks in the Vice again, Jericho goes for the knees again -- and Punk slides about six inches higher up Jericho's body so the knees can't reach, leading to the submission. Just awesome awareness that makes sense from a competitive standpoint.
Not sure if we'll get more of this feud, but I won't complain if we do. If this hadn't gotten third billing on the same card as an all-time classic and the Rock-Cena hypefest, it might be a MOTY candidate.

Rock-Cena: Stunning that Rock won. Just stunning. As others have said, this has to lead to some major character development for Cena or else it's just odd. I just hope it doesn't lead to a rematch. One year of hype bordered on self-fellatio. Two years, and the WWE will be tossing its own salad.
This match did suffer from one of the pitfalls of a long match. Any time you commit to a 25-30 minute match, there are almost always going to be stretches of inactivity. And there were plenty of them. Still, considering Rock had barely wrestled in seven years, gutting out a 30-minute match was pretty impressive.

 

I'm surprised at the Bryan-Sheamus backlash. Bryan is going to have a spat with A.J., and it's probably going to be either intentionally funny or unintentionally hilarious. And he lost to Sheamus,who IS a young guy. And while the Bryan marks were pissed off he didn't get a chance, the folks I watched with thought it was hilarious.

"I have no problem with that," my brother said. "At all. Perfect."

Punk won. Clean. They brought Jericho back for the sole purpose of putting him over. And the match itself was really, really good, even if the fans weren't into it (Miami sucks).

I don't understand the Cena result, but I'm sure it will make more sense tonight.

The same people beating the "give the young guys a chance" drum are the same guys who loved the Undertaker match.

Does the WWE need new stars? I suppose, but it's not like they were going to build any last night when Rock-Cena and Triple H-Undertaker were the main event matches.

 

Daniel Bryan (c) vs Sheamus - World Heavyweight Title
Seriously? You take the match that could have been the sleeper and turn it into the seconds only match? What's the **** wrong with you WWE?! You hear that "Bull****" chant as you went to the back? That's your fans who had paid a lot of money to see the show live and you just gave them the complete opposite of what they wanted to see. Congratulations WWE, you pretty much caused me to be in a sour mood at the very start of your biggest show of the year. Bryan/Sheamus just can't catch a ****ing break.

Randy Orton vs Kane
Daniel Bryan chants. Hmm, I wonder why they're chanting his name. Can you think of a single reason, WWE? ****ing morons. This ended up being good for a Kane match. The beginning was fast pace and thus interesting enough. The middle slowed down and dragged. On the plus side, the ending picked up the pace and they ended on a high note. Orton losing was pretty shocking to me. 2 3/4 Stars.

Cody Rhodes (c) vs The Big Show - WWE IC Title
What's with all of the SD matches? This was pretty enjoyable for what it was. I haven't checked the time length, but it felt rather. The end result is a match that didn't suffer from any boring moments like Kane/Orton, but it also lacks any sort of depth that made Orton/Kane good. Dug Cody's strategy, but loved Show's post-match celebration more. Show crying over winning the IC title is the biggest rub the belt has received in a long time. Cody Rhodes may have held the belt for over 200 days, but seeing a former World Champion seem so emotional over winning the belt trumps anything Rhodes did (Not a whole lot) easily. 2 1/2 Stars.

Kelly Kelly and Maria Menunhoweveryouspellit vs Beth Phoenix and Eve
Hey, more Daniel Bryan chants. They must have really loved his match, eh WWE? **** I hate you. Kelly Kelly looked pretty decent out there. The Molly Go Round was a nice little surprise. The parts with Maria dragged the match down a good deal. I'll say this though, if Maria was selling the ribs and she was perfectly fine, she basically had the Diva's version of a Ricky Steamboat sell job. I was starting to worry about the poor girl's safety. The match sucked, but what else would you expect? 3/4 Star.

The Undertaker vs Triple H - Hell in a Cell
This is the perfect example of that old analogy that wrestling is soap opera for me. Everything about this was for the story. Michaels was the sniveling and kindhearted Christian who just didn't want to see either man hurt. The moment he super kicks Taker out of anger that Taker locked in the Hell's Gates was great. You can imagine Shawn thinking WWJD? in his head and realizing he did the wrong thing and it may just cost someone their most precious property. Hunter was the ruthless and defiant one who didn't have any qualms on killing Taker as long as it meant he'd win. Finally, there's Taker, a guy willing to sacrifice himself it it means keeping the streak. Anyone who stood in his way of winning (Michaels possibly ending the match) must be stopped. By the end, you had the huge contrast to WM 27. Taker now stronger and confident as he finishes Triple H off. This wasn't about being lucky in locking in the Hell's Gates, Taker was the one controlling his fate. With the exception of one (I believe the second to last false finish...maybe the one before that), I bought into all of the false finishes and just got more excited as the match went on. Everything about this was just plain awesome. They told a very different story from WM 27, the fans were so into it and Michaels added a different element. Maybe my opinion will change a little once I see this for a second time (While knowing the result), but for now 5 Stars.

Team Johnny vs Team Teddy
The vast majority of this match was completely forgettable. It was a death sentence putting it on after Taker/Trips and the fans showed that with their lack of reactions. The action did pick up at the end though. The Divas match and this should have switched places. Just okay. 2 1/4 Stars.

CM Punk (c) vs Chris Jericho - WWE World Title
I felt they could have used another match buffer between this and HIAC. The fans got into it at the end, but it took time to get that emotion. Likewise, this will probably feel more entertaining on a Best of DVD. Now enough downplaying because this is actually a really good match. It was all about Jericho and his strategy. Early on, it was trying to cause Punk to get himself DQ'd. When Jericho realized that wouldn't work, he focused on the back of Punk. Once that finally wouldn't work, it just became a sprint to see who could get lucky and keep on a submission long enough so that the other would have to give up. I'm willing to give this match a little more praise for fighting through and getting the crowd back into the show. A lot of matches wouldn't have been able to do that. A HUGE improvement on last year's WWE World Title match. 4 Stars.

The Rock vs John Cena
I think the fans giving a damn automatically made this better than Cena/Miz from last year. It was a good match that had the second biggest fan reaction. I'm a little surprised at how pro Cena the crowd was. Rock was still clearly the more popular guy, but Cena had a lot of support. There were a few little timing issues and both guys got to show off their ****ty submission holds. I dug the stories of Taker/Hunter and Punk/Jericho more than this. Cena once again showed that he's the master of not taking anything serious. You're in the biggest match of your career and you just failed to pin The Rock with a second FU. How do you react? By smiling and joking around with a mock People's Elbow of course! I swear, someone could hold a gun to Cena's head and he'd be cracking jokes and laughing. Solid match, great crowd. I'd say it's a middle of the road WM main event. It's easily not a bad WM main event (Miz/Cena, Sid/Hogan, Hunter/Orton), but it's not among the best WM has produced (Triple threat, Hogan/Savage, Hogan/Warrior). It's in the Austin/Michaels quality. 3 1/2 Stars.