2013 Pro Wrestling Thread

I think it is time to stop calling Survivor Series one of the "big four." At this point, it is an entirely dated concept that should probably be put out to pasture unless they reduce the # of PPVs. It's pretty much indistinguishable from the rest of the PPV schedule outside of RR, WM, and SummerSlam.

I am waiting for the year that 'Mania's buyrate completely tanks. WWE relies on one week out of the year for such a large % of their profit that one disappointing year could be disastrous.

 

For years I have called Randy Savage the original Mr. WrestleMania. He competed in eight of the first ten manias and was always involved in one of the bigger matches on the card. Let’s take a brief look at Savage’s history at WrestleMania.

WM2: Savage defended the IC title against George the Animal Steele. This was all about the angle rather than the match as no one would mistake Steele for a great ring technician. Good angle with Steele falling for Elizabeth while Savage treated her like dirt but the match itself was nothing to write home about. Still Savage walked into mania as the IC champ and successfully defended his title.

WM3: The famous classic against Ricky Steamboat. To this day many people still call it their all time favorite match. Savage lost but that doesn't matter. It’s a performance that still holds up over 25 years later.

WM4: While none of his matches that night would be called a classic this night was all about Savage. He wrestled and won four times to become the WWF Champion. He was the man chosen to carry the belt after Hogan’s legendary four year reign.

WM5: Walking into WrestleMania as the world champion to main event against Hulk Hogan. It doesn't get any bigger than that.

WM6: While not nearly as big as some of his other mania appearances this is an underrated mania for Savage. A lot of people didn't like the mixed tag match and would have preferred Savage vs. Rhodes one on one. We've seen a million mixed tag matches over the years now but in 1990 it was a first and that created a lot of buzz. As always Savage put on a great show despite the challenging circumstances.

WM7: One of my all time favorite mania moments. After a grueling career ending match against The Ultimate Warrior we were treated to the emotional reunion between Randy Savage and Elizabeth. Great build, great match, great crowd, great drama.

WM8: Savage gets another legend at mania this time defeating Ric Flair for the title. Another match built on emotion and another classic delivered by Savage.

WM10: Crush wasn't as big a name as Savage’s past mania opponents but this was a big feud in 1993/1994. Savage gave the WWF another first as this was the first falls count anywhere match for the company. Good build but unfortunately the match was a dud.

Which mania was Savage’s best? You can base it on anything you want. It doesn't just have to be quality of match. You can take that into consideration along with hype, drama, significance, or whatever you like. I think there’s a strong case to be made for 3, 4, 5, 7, and 8.

 

Re: the buyrates, as I understand it, it's mostly the cable companies that are pushing for keeping the 12 PPVs (or whatever it is) a year. They make money off of each one, even if sales are ultimately disappointing, and they probably don't care as much about the longterm health of the WWE as the WWE would, obviously.

 

I was too young to have watched or remember anything before WM 5 but I will always remember the Savage/Flair buildup and match. It was one of the first times the young me really understood the idea of storytelling in wrestling. They built that thing perfectly and then delivered a great match with two of the most charismatic stars of all time. Love that match.

 

I get more excited for Money in the Bank than Survivor Series. I wouldn't mind if it took over as the premier PPV for the fall season. Then we still get the Rumble as the winter's big show, Wrestlemania for spring, SummerSlam for, uh, summer.

 

Anybody here go to WWE house shows? Huggy Jr is a wrestling fan so for Christmas I got tickets for us to go to a show in Toronto on Dec. 30. It will be his first live event and my first card since WM6. Are the house shows a scaled-down version of Raw without the endless in-ring yapping and commercial breaks?

 

It's been a long time since I've been to a house show, but, outside of PPVs, they are more fun than going to Raw or Smackdown. If your kid is pretty young, I'd say he'll enjoy the house show much more than Raw. Raw can get extremely tedious between all of the commercial breaks, backstage segments, and ridiculously long promos.

You basically get a lot more actual in-ring wrestling with scaled down production. Don't expect pyro or the giant titan tron.

I went to a WCW house show in Shreveport, LA at the start of the nWo storyline. The Giant had recently joined the nWo and one of the main events was Outsiders/Giant vs. Dungeon of Doom in a six man tag. The crowd got so crazy with throwing trash and beer in the ring that the show got stopped for about 30 minutes while the nWo left the ring. Kevin Nash got on the mic and cursed out the crowd and threatened to "fucking walk out if one more piece of trash is thrown in this ring." Of course, someone drills him upside the head with a beer and the nWo walks out. The cops had to come out and threatened to start arresting people if the garbage didn't stop. Things eventually settled down, but not until someone had thrown one of those old WWF Hulk Hogan "Pillow Buddies" in the ring, which the DOD did a series of leg/elbow drops on. Easily one of my favorite memories.

Here are the results:

Diamond Dallas Page pinned Joe Gomez
John Tenta defeated Hugh Morrus via disqualification when Morrus attacked Tenta with a chair as Tenta came out for the match
Scott Norton defeated Ice Train via count-out
WCW Tag Team Champions Harlem Heat defeated Rick Steiner & Terry Taylor (sub. for Scott Steiner)
Kevin Nash, Scott Hall, & the Giant defeated the Barbarian, Hugh Morrus, & Big Bubba
Lex Luger pinned WCW US Champion Ric Flair in a non-title match; Flair originally won the match after hitting Luger with brass knuckles but the bout was ordered to continue

I went to a WWF house show in Tempe, AZ when I was five or six. I don't remember a lot about it, other than my dad buying me a Big Boss Man foam nightstick.

Shane Douglas pinned Black Bart
The Big Bossman defeated Bobby Heenan
Demolition defeated the Bushwhackers
WWF World Champion the Ultimate Warrior defeated Randy Savage via count-out
Sgt. Slaughter defeated Jim Duggan
The Legion of Doom defeated the Orient Express & Mr. Fuji in a handicap match when Animal pinned Kato

 

Woke up early this morning and decided to watch Wrestlemania 8. Here's my review.



Shawn Michaels w/Sherri vs Tito Santana
So Michaels turned on his Rockers' partner, Marty Jannetty, at the start of the year. That reminded the Rockers' buddy, Santana, of when his Strike Force partner, Rick Martel, turned on him. Thus, this match. Okay, not really, but isn't it nicer to have a match with a real purpose than just thrown together? The majority of the match was really dull with Santana sitting on a side headlock while Michaels killed some time by casually working over Santana's back. Things finally picked up near the end when Santana came back with his flying forearm, but that only sent Michaels to the outside. Back in, Michaels is hit with Santana's El Matador finisher, El Paso de la Muerte (Flying forearm to the back of his head), but once again that caused Michaels to roll out of the ring. From there, Michaels wins when Santana loses his balance when lifting Michaels over the top rope and back into the ring. Sherri had one job in the match (Grab Santana's legs to cause the trip) and she messed that up. Even with the botched finish, it was hardly a noteworthy singles debut at Wrestlemania for Michaels. **



The Undertaker w/Paul Bearer vs Jake Roberts
Back at SNME 30, Undertaker turned face when he refused to let Roberts hit Miss Elizabeth with a chair. So in Taker's twisted logic - stuffing men into locked caskets in an attempt to kill them = good. Hitting women with chairs = bad. For the most part, this was just a squash seeing as Undertaker doesn't sell anything Roberts does. At best, Taker remains down for a few moments after a DDT just to impress everyone by sitting up. Other than that, the match is filled with Taker beating up Roberts. Finish comes with Roberts DDT'ing Taker for a second time, but instead of going for the cover, he rolled to the outside to attack Paul Bearer. Taker wakes up and gives Roberts a Tombstone on the outside. Rolling back in, Taker pins Roberts to go 2-0. With that, Taker's free to move on to his first long term program as a babyface and Roberts won't be seen again in the WWE until 1996. That's what happens when you spin a wheel and make a deal. Match was a little more entertaining than the Taker/Snuka match. * 3/4

Roddy Piper (c) vs Bret Hart - WWE IC Title
After Hart lost the IC title to The Mountie due to a sickness, long time family friend, Roddy Piper, was there to help him out and avenge his loss by quickly ending The Mountie's reign. Now that Bret's back, these two friends must decide if they're willing to let a championship belt get between them. IT'S A SOAP OPERA~! Early on, it's very respectful and tame. Both guys start off with hitting arm drags. From there, the two characters really begin to be developed. On one hand, there's Bret. He's smart and clever. He always has some sort of counter up his sleeve to get the best of Piper. On the other hand, there's Piper. He lives up to his Hot Rod nickname by not being able to keep his cool. Oh sure, early on, he wants to keep things mellow, but the more he gets outsmarted by Hart, the more he throws caution to the wind and disrespects Bret. There's a moment early in the match that is important. Piper is stuck in a wristlock and can't shake Hart. So Piper begins throwing as many chops as possible to try and free himself. It doesn't work, but it does show that Piper is still calm enough that he doesn't resort to throwing punches. By the middle of the match, Piper has lost his composure and he's ready to release his bottled up anger. That comes out with a series of kicks to Bret's face, which busts Hart open. This match of initial mutual respect nears the end as Piper and a crimson mask Bret are trading punches on their knees. That respect is seemingly gone. It's after a ref bump that Piper faces the big decision of the match. Retrieving the ring bell from outside of the ring, Piper contemplates using it on Bret. On one hand, it'd guarantee a victory. On the other hand, doing so would forever ruin the respect they share and the respect the fans hold for Piper. Finally, Piper decides to throw the bell outside of the ring with the fans erupting in celebration. At this point, the fans don't care who wins. They're just elated that Piper didn't go to the dark side. From there, the match wraps up with the classic finish of Bret countering Piper's sleeper into a roll-up (Similar finish to Hart/Austin Survivor Series '96) to win the match and begin his second IC Title reign. Despite testing their friendship throughout the match, Piper is able to put everything aside by just celebrating his friend's win. It's one of the best Soap Opera like matches in WWE history. Fuck, I love this match. An easy WWE MOTYC. **** 1/4



Mountie, Repo Man & Nasty Boys w/Jimmy Hart vs Big Boss Man, Virgil, Jim Duggan & Sgt. Slaughter
Just a match to get as many men on the show as possible. Family Feud host, Ray Combs handles the ring introductions to give the commentators a chance to hype the upcoming week long edition of Family Feud featuring the WWF vs WBF. The only important thing to know going into this match is that Virgil is wearing a face mask ever since Sid Justice broke his nose in order to get over his new heel persona. Match wasn't anything special (Who would have expected it to be?), but it did keep a good pace with plenty of comedy spots. The only one who seemed to be trying was Boss Man. In the end, Brian Knobbs pulled Virgil's mask off of his face, but when Jerry Sags tried to hit Virgil with it, Virgil ducked and Knobbs was hit. Virgil quickly covered Knobbs for the victory. Boss Man deserved better. **

Ric Flair (c) w/Mr. Perfect vs Randy Savage - WWE World Title

Even though the match was thrown together at the last minute, the WWE created a memorable program based around Flair claiming he had dated Elizabeth before she met Randy and that he had "Special photos" of her. For the match itself, you can feel it's a grudge feud. They don't do any sort of BS like a tie-up to being the match. Instead, there's a lot of intensity. Mr. Perfect ends up having his best Wrestlemania performance by cheating non-stop. Whether the referee is distracted or not, he's always there to help out his man from the very beginning of attacking Savage immediately after the bell or late in the match when he hits Savage in the knee with a chair shot. Speaking of the chair shot, Savage's selling is so great that he STILL was selling the knee when the WWE went to Europe later in the month. Flair being busted open only further got over the bitterness of the feud. Still, the match does have a huge problem in the form of Elizabeth. After Savage has his knee injured, she runs out to cheer on her man. For the final five minutes of the match, various WWE officials (Including a young Shane McMahon) tries to order her back to the locker room. First of all, why does it matter if she's out there? In all of the years she's been in the WWE, not once had she ever intentionally interfered while that's all Mr. Perfect had been doing in the match. The other problem is so much of the focus is on her that the actual action in the ring (Which is awesome drama) is being a little ignored. It's too much of a distraction and seeing as Elizabeth didn't do anything, it's pointless. Despite this glaring problem, it's still a great match and I loved the little touch of Savage winning by pulling the tights to pay Flair back for all of his cheating. *** 3/4



After the match, an enraged Ric Flair screams at Elizabeth before pulling her in for a kiss. Instead of allowing Savage come to her rescue, Elizabeth goes ape shit on Flair, slapping him repeatedly until Flair falls over. One of my favorite Elizabeth moments.

Rick Martel vs Tatanka
Tatanka had just debuted on WWE TV at the start of the year and immediately found a rival in Rick Martel. The feud didn't have much of an issue other than neither guy liking each other though. Rough spot on the card to be in though. The crowd is tired from the WWE World Title match, the commentators spend half of this match talking about Ric Flair and the lack of any real issue made this instantly forgettable. Unlike their Survivor Series match, it was a lot shorter, so it didn't drag on at all. Still, I just didn't care about it at all. Tatanka would pull off the victory with a running cross body. Meh. Just as uninteresting as their rematch.

Money Inc. (c) w/Jimmy Hart vs The Natural Disasters - WWE Tag Titles
Since last autumn, The Natural Disasters, with their then manager, Jimmy Hart, had been feuding with the tag champions, Legion of Doom. After being unsuccessful at the Royal Rumble, the Natural Disasters saw their rematch at a house show given away to IRS and Ted DiBiase by Jimmy Hart. The newly formed Money Inc won the belts and took Hart on as their manager. Feeling slighted, The Disasters turned face and dumped Jimmy Hart. When it comes to Natural Disaster matches, it's always fine as long as Earthquake handles most of the work. Sadly, it's Typhoon who's given the role of being a face-in-peril during this. Outside of a fun sequence early on when Earthquake destroys Money Inc, this was bad. Made even worse by the fact that to avoid an Earthquake Splash, IRS was dragged out of the ring by DiBiase. The champions then just left to lose by count-out, but retain the titles. What an underwhelming conclusion to an already bad match. 3/4 *



Skinner vs Owen Hart
These old PPV's sure loved putting on really random matches just to get as many wrestlers on the show as possible. So after being together for a few months as the New Foundation, the team ended after one of the million of times that Jim Neidhart was fired. To the WWE's credit, instead of just giving up on Owen, they still found ways of using him as a lowcarder to get TV time before being put with Koko B. Ware as High Energy. Match is really short with Skinner spitting the tobacco juice in Owen's eyes. After a few moves by Skinner, Owen skins the cat and surprises Skinner with a roll-up to win the match. Hart makes history by winning a Wrestlemania match without hitting an actual move. Too short to even rate. Not Rated.

It's worth mentioning that throughout the night, the WWE kept interviewing guys that weren't even wrestling on the show. You had Legion of Doom making their first appearance since losing the WWE Tag Titles. They announce the arrival of their manager, Paul Ellering. Then you have the WWE TV debut of Lex Luger, hyping his arrival to the WBF. Finally, you have Brutus Beefcake talking about the main event.

Hulk Hogan vs Sid Justice w/Harvey Wippleman
Like every friend Hogan has ever had, Justice eventually grew tired of Hogan stealing the spotlight. After being cost the WWE World Title at the Royal Rumble because of Hogan, Justice was then "Rewarded" by WWE President, Jack Tunney, naming Hulk Hogan as the #1 contender to the WWE World Championship. That led to Justice turning heel by refusing to accept a tag from Hogan during a tag match at SNME 30. While the build was fun because Hogan was so damn lovable as the completely oblivious friend, the match was terrible. It's twelve minutes long, but it feels like over twenty. There isn't any direction to the match as Justice just beats on Hogan without ever trying to win the match. The thing that really kills the match is that the dull match ends when the ending is completely botched. Papa Shango was supposed to run out and break up the pin for the DQ, but he missed his cue. So instead, Justice kicks out of the leg drop (What?!) while Harvey Wippleman climbs into the ring. The referee calls for the bell when Hogan picks Wippleman up to throw on Justice. Why would it be a DQ? Wippleman didn't even lay a finger on Hogan. Worst yet is that this is the MAIN EVENT OF WRESTLEMANIA! And it ends in a DQ that doesn't even make sense. Worst main event in Wrestlemania history? . 3/4 *



After the match, Papa Shango finally made it to the ring to attack Hogan. Justice and Shango joined forces for a two-on-one beat down. With that, you then have the shocking return of the Ultimate Warrior. Warrior's return scores the biggest reaction of the night. The crowd is fucking loving it. Honestly, Warrior's return is one of the more underrated moments in WM history. Warrior and Hogan clear the ring and then celebrate together for the next five minutes to close out the show.

Overall
Let's start with the good. WM 8 gave us two great matches, one of which is another WWE MOTYC. I can't get enough of Piper vs Hart and it's one of Piper's best matches while also being a huge match in turning Bret into a major player in the WWE. The return of the Ultimate Warrior was a nice bonus to end the show. As I said, it's one of the most underrated moments of the event's history. There's some appeal to watching this show as you can see the beginnings of The New Generation. Three of the winners of the night are new heel Shawn Michaels, major singles star Bret Hart, and crowd favorite Undertaker. You can even point to Tatanka and Lex Luger's PPV debut as being part of the core New Generation group. With that being said, most of the other matches on the show besides the best two are dreadful. As I said, Hogan/Sid is my pick for worst main event in Wrestlemania history. Part of the problem of the show is all of the bad finishes. The main event and tag titles match ended in a BS count-out/DQ finish. The WWE World Title match may have been really good, but the finish had too much of a focus on Elizabeth. The Martel/Tatanka ending fell flat and came out of nowhere. Not to mention the first and last match ended with a botch finish. Like most of the early Mania's there's great aspects of the show, but there's plenty where you need to keep your thumb on the fast forward button.

Bonus Match

Roddy Piper vs Shawn Michaels w/Sherri - March to Wrestlemania 8
March to Wrestlemania was the special edition of Primetime Wrestling devoted to hyping Wrestlemania. The previous year's special, Stars and Stripes Forever, featured the big Mr. Perfect vs Shawn Michaels match that showed fans that Michaels could be a singles star. The year before that, The Ultimate Challenge, saw The Rockers challenge for the WWE tag team titles against The Colossal Connection. Anyways, this is one of Michaels' very first significant singles matches since turning heel. Since he's already challenging the winner of the IC Title match at Wrestlemania for a future shot, putting on a good showing is essential. Since he's wrestling Piper, that means we get some predictable (And awesome) heated sequences where you believe they're bitter enemies even though there isn't an issue. There's a great spot where Piper runs into a super kick before sitting up, no selling it. A ref bump sets up a finish that does a hell of a job at hyping Piper vs Hart. With the ref out, Sherri threw her boot in to Shawn, so he could hit Piper. Once Piper recovers, Bret runs out to help out Piper by throwing him Sherri's boot. Piper swings at Michaels, but the referee wakes in time to see him. Piper's DQ'd and Michaels scores an important win in his quest to become IC Champion. After the match, Piper loses his temper and yells at Bret for interfering and getting him DQ'd. Just like in the Wrestlemania match, Piper's friendship with Bret is tested by his own short fuse all while Hart was trying to help his buddy. Hell of a fun free TV match. But really, you can never go wrong with Piper. ***

 

I enjoyed this. The 3-Man Band of Jobbers posing as the Fabulous Freebirds in match against the PTP.

http://www.wwe.com/videos/the-fabulous-3birds-vs-the-prime-time-players-wwecom-exclusive-nov-22-2013-26165900

What really makes it fun is JBL's commentary, with a myriad of World Class and Mid-South references.

 

Fun recap, as always Gehrig. WM8 has a special spot in my heart. I was in college at the time, and one of my floormates had a friend of theirs tape it on a VCR, then overnight it to him, where he showed it to a group of us. So I thought I was living large, getting to watch a PPV just a mere day after it actually happened, without even knowing the results.

A couple of other things:

1. I'm pretty sure they were going to have HBK face Jannetty, but Marty had gotten himself fired right after their breakup, so they never really had that immediate blowoff.

2. Heenan and Gorilla's commentary is great, as usual. I love it when Heenan goes nuts over Piper putting the bell away.

3. I think it's been yanked off Youtube, but one of the greatest Flair moments is his promo afterward, when he goes absolutely ballistic.

4. Oh, and worst WM main event of all time? Hogan vs. Yokozuna, that 10-second fiasco after the Bret Hart match. Back when WWF was as stupid as can be.

 

Thanks. I always appreciate when you read them and leave your thoughts.

Chances are that's the original plan. Marty was fantastic at getting himself fired.

Honestly, their commentary was the only thing entertaining about the Tatanka/Martel match. You had such gems as Monsoon yelling "You're a liar!" after everything Heenan said. Eventually, Heenan got so upset that he challenged Monsoon to a fight.

Doesn't seem fair to count that as it wasn't actually the main event. Furthermore, I'd rather watch a ten second match of stupid booking than 12 minutes of a snoozefest with a terrible ending.

 

I've been to several house shows as I usually don't live anywhere near big enough for TV. I've been to a WCW Nitro in 2000 and WWF Armageddon in 2000, both in Birmingham. Everything in Idaho? House show.

That said, it's still a blast. They move a lot faster because there are no commercial breaks (although these days that doesn't mean much as the match continues on the WWE App). Not a ton of promos either. No pyro. They've added in recent years a small entrance ramp with lights and a video screen to go with entrance music, but that's it.

The house shows are trial runs for matches you might see a few nights later on Raw and SmackDown. My last house show in 2011 was Orton and Christian in a street fight, working out spots for SummerSlam.

You can still see many of the big stars, even at a house show. I've seen HBK, Jericho, Cena, Batista, Orton, Big Show, Bryan, Sheamus, etc. Still haven't seen Punk. He was always on the opposite brand of whatever show I saw, back when the brand extension meant something.

I always sit on the floor, never more than five rows back. And the seats weren't too bad for price. Maybe $50 a pop for a floor seat that close. Less than most concert tickets these days. And it's worth it. The talents are so close to you, it's great. My wife caught John Cena's sweaty armband at a show in 2009. We framed it. Didn't wash it first, either.

Of course, a big reason they do house shows is the jacked-up merchandise sales. You'll easily spend $5 to $10 extra on a shirt that you can buy online. Rarely do they have something not on the online shop.

Have fun.