2014 NBA Playoffs thread

Maybe the Spurs win next season and we're debating Duncan and his six vs. Jordan and his six.

 

That's fair. And why most of us have included the caveat that LeBron's career is a long way from over.

But I will say this: All other things being equal, I'd cast my vote with the guy who went out on or close to the top over the guy who hung around too long.

 

OK, so did Jordan go out on top (second retirement) or do you hold his Wizards career over his head?

 

This. Jordan was probably better than James, but 95% of the arguments put forth in favor of that fact are awful.

 

Actually, I do think the argument is ridiculous.

I'm not sure why every year we have to decide where players rank.

 

I think his legacy would've been slightly more polished had he stayed retired the second time. His time with the Wizards didn't hurt his legacy in any significant way, but it didn't help, either. It certainly shouldn't be wiped from the record books, though, as some are arguing.

The general concept is not unlike what happened to Brett Favre.

 

and to me I look at their primes. I never hold it against a guy for playing as long as someone is willing to pay them. It's still sports and a if you are still enjoying it and getting paid I'd play as long as humanly possible.

 

Exactly.

I do think Jordan was better but the denigrating of Lebron is absurd.

 

And what I find so maddening is this idea that basketball can be reduced to a final stat line. Go back and watch what was happening in that game or that series, or, if not that, at least look at what was being written and said (and keep it to people you know and trust about basketball if you want). He did not want the ball in the fourth quarter. He stood 30 feet from the basket and played hot potato, he passed up open shots, he was a deer in the headlights. This was acknowledged far and wide at the time, but now when we have only the stat line, you look at it and say "hmm, 17/10/10 doesn't look so bad."

In the first five games of that series, LeBron's fourth-quarter total was 11 points. And you know, it was his role to score. At some point down the stretch, the NBA's second-leading scorer probably should have attempted to score.

Here is one place that put it together at the time. It was historically awful.

http://espn.go.com/blog/truehoop/miamiheat/post/_/id/8778/the-lebron-james-4th-quarter-experience

 

In fairness, Jordan DID twice retire on top, indeed he twice retired at times when he was the absolute best player in the world. Which is a shame for hoops fans, because years of his prime were left of the cutting room floor.

Instead, the Wizard years we're talking about here are a situation where a retired guy, who's been out of the game for more than three years, decides to try a "what the hell, I'm bored" comeback, and at a different SF position that he'd never played before. That is something distinctly different than simply "a guy who hung around too long."

 

He has had some truly weird moments. Those finals he deserves the criticism he has received. It's the 98% of the other stuff that becomes ridiculous.

 

Although, I would argue that Favre's final three years in the league did irreparable damage to his legacy, not so much because of how he played, but because of the drama he brought with him, with the yearly "will he or won't he" combined with his replacement winning a Super Bowl.

I think most people give Jordan a pass for his time with the Wizards, and I'm not really sure why. Maybe it's because he was so much older than everyone, playing injured and still at a pretty respectable (if not Jordanesque) level.