All-Purpose, Never-Ending Soccer Thread

I hit post and see Twoback slid one in. So, I'll just post here that I do not consider your idea bad in the slightest. I actually like it quite a bit.



Zizz,
1. If the Revs aren't getting 10K in July and only a few times have broken the 10K mark in nice weather, why would they get that in the snow? I would absolutely love it if the teams could draw in the winter, but the Crew is only drawing about 12K and they have their own stadium! I just don't see having too many games in the cold snow will help.

2. I've gone back and forth in my head about the single table in MLS. I understand the reasoning regarding the current situation. If they do the home-and-home while keeping the schedule at 32-games when the league expands to 16-teams, they should go to a single table. I am just not so hung up on this issue.

3. I did not ignore where you said to stop catering to American fans and start catering to soccer fans. I have just watched MLS attempt to cater to soccer fans who continue to dismiss the league without even attempting to give it a chance.

A great example of this occurred three quarters of the way into last season. Alexi Lalas was recently named GM of the MetroStars. He reserved the meeting room at some bar and requested the attendance of the NY Blues, a group of Chelsea supporters.

Lalas went to the meeting, held court and provided free drinks to all in attendance. Two buddies of mine went, both are season ticket holders of RBNY and one of which is in the NY Blues. Lalas asked, "What can we do to make the league more appealing to you?" The answer came back in various forms of the word "nothing."

The meeting lasted two hours and the NY Blues were drinking for free on the MetroStars dime. Did any of them bother coming to a game that season? No.

Lalas went over all sorts of suggestions, including all that you have mentioned here, and it basically came down to the idea that these individuals were dead set on the idea that MLS was an inferior league and they weren't going to watch (this included the statement about swapping rosters with an EPL team).

I'm fairly convinced that the only way to gain the Euro-Snob crowd is to continue progressing the league to the point where it is spending the most money, it contains the best players (of which a predominant are American), and its teams regularly triumph over any and all foreign teams.

Just like the thousands that came out to Giants Stadium to watch a shit game between Celtic and Chivas de Guadelajara. I had a friend go down to DC to watch Celtic get smashed by DC United 4-0 and then watch Celtic tie, 0-0, against Chivas de G. Yet, this same guy won't go to a RBNY game. It doesn't matter to him that DC torn the team a new asshole. To him, the excuses were ready made and he wasn't having it.

4. I see where you are going with the All-Star thing. But, there are people that are geared up for such things. Chicago drew 21K for the All-Star game. Yes, it is all a big show, but all other American Leagues have All-Star games and there is no real reason to hate it. You don't want to spend the money? Fine, don't. Lots of other people will spend it and will watch it.

5. Plenty of people were annoyed at FC Dallas. I can't even count the amount of times I heard, "What does the F stand for?" Then you had the "If the league is Major League Soccer, why is a team using the initial for football?"

Houston 1836 was received with vitriol and comparisons to being a Euro-poseur name. We had the thread here on the subject. I was one of the few that defended it. Then, the team went to Dynamo and more mud was thrown on it. Toronto FC received similar scorn.


Zizzer, I see what you are saying, but I just have too much experience to the contrary. I would love for the league to emulate that which exists in Europe, but it can't. And even if it did, I'm certain that the Euro-snobs would just come back with, "Well they can't play like Europe so they just try to act like it."

It is almost a no win scenario.

 

I'll go you one further -- it is a no-win. If you go too far toward the soccer mom demographic (youth soccer, non-soccer fans, families who attend 1-2 games each year), you alienate the hard-core supporters groups and the Europoseurs. Likewise, giving everything a Euro slant alienates the casual/non-fan and, with the lack of a second league for promotion/relegation, seems rather pointless.

The good Pastor is right on regarding casual fans vs. Eurosnobs. Casual fans have shown they will at least go to games once in a while, be it for special promotions, concerts, fireworks, etc. The Europoseurs won't even do that -- they'd rather stay home and watch some English game on the telly.

Dropping the shootout, eliminating the golden-goal overtime and making the clock count up didn't bring the Eurocentric fans pouring into the stadiums. What's the point in continuing to make concessions to a group of "soccer fans" who, in the 11 years of MLS, haven't even made an effort to meet the league halfway? At what point do we cross the line where the Europoseurs say, "OK, now I'll come watch?"

 

I love the MLS, but the whole talk of Chelsea not taking them lightly needs to stop. That was a team that had not played a game yet, had only been training for about 2 weeks, whilie the MLS stars were in midseason form.

Look at last year when the MLS Select XI went to El Stadio Bernabeu and got their asses handed to them by Real Madrid, a team that was in form.

That being said, I'm looking forward to the D.C. United game tonight in Seattle (why the fuck is it out there) against Real...

 

Madrid's other US tour game is against Fake Salt Lake, so they probably wanted somewhere close. DC got picked because the game fit into their schedule.
http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/sports/2003149727_realmadrid25.html

 

Whoever refers to Freddy Adu as a phenom should be banned from writing another word about soccer.

Plus, no mention of Cristian Gomez -- a solid candidate for the MLS's top player award.

 

There's a lot better chance non-soccer fans know Freddy Adu's name than that of Christian Gomez.

And unless there's a glut of 17-year-olds being consistent contributors while starting all but two of their team's matches, I'd say Adu still fits comfortably into the 'phenom' category.

 

So would you mention Bobby Convey as a phenom (who was a decent piece of United several years ago as a 17-year old)?...serviceable yes, but phenom??? Extremely doubtful.

 

Not at all. Adu has 10 goals, 15 assists and 49 starts in his two and a half-year career, which started when he was 15. Convey started his pro career at 17 and had eight total goals in just over four seasons before he went to Reading.

 

I love the suggestion that a group of players who'd only marginally been together as a team (the half or so that play for DCU) were somehow in midseason form. They have no freaking form. They're an all-star team. They might be in condition, but they had to function cohesively with minimal practice. That they were able to do so was impressive. Chelsea's best players were off for about a month. Unless they were involved in unspeakable debauchery during that time, their condition couldn't be that bad. No one's saying the MLS stars approach what Chelsea has, but the point is that they were not overwhelmed.
That exhibition last year where the MLS team got crushed at Real -- that team basically stepped off the plane and onto the pitch. Chelsea had a week to get acclimated and couldn't blow out this team.

 

To further expand upon Twoback's statement...

Not only was the MLS Select XI just stepping off of a plane in order to play a game in Spain, but they had two practices together before doing so. By that point Real was ready to start their season against the rest of Spain and Europe.

So, last year, you have a group of guys thrown together at the last minute, put on a plane and told to play in a foreign country many probably have never been to against a team that has been tuning itself up for over a month.

Chelsea had been practicing together for two weeks while the MLS All-Stars probably had less than 4-practices together.

The two situations do not compare at all.

I'd buy that Chelsea's team wasn't fully match fit for the summer temperatures we've been experiencing. But, their players were trying and they were looking to win. The mere fact that Real's manager needed to poo-poo the result after the game with an ever expanding list of excuses says all you need to know.

 

I stand by my belief that the MLS is currently a gimmick-driven enterprise. Call me a Eurosnob if you want, I don't give a shit. I like the natural atmosphere generated by other leagues far better than the artificial crap - and the incessant kids running around screaming their lungs off and paying zero attention to the game - that the MLS throws out there.

That's the other thing I don't get. People were up in arms about Dave O'Brien calling games during the World Cup because he's not a soccer guy, but now it's that MLS needs to be more like the other sports.

And the attendance issue - Each of the cities I mentioned before (NE, Chicago, Columbus) will draw the same number (around 10-12k) regardless of when you play the match. Play it at 3 am in the middle of winter and you'll still have that crowd. There's nothing to be ashamed of about that.

 

It's not a question of making MLS "more like other sports."
It's a question of why not operate it like an American league? What does single-table give you in the EPL. A whole crapload of meaningless April and May games, and the total absence of the Super Bowl excitement you get here in the U.S. There are some things we do better, so why force our league to follow the format of the European leagues? I mean, you either are going to give the soccer a shot or you're not. Frankly, this aspect of soccer fandom in this country complete mystifies me. I just don't get it.
I don't get to as many MLS games as I'd like, because I don't have a team in my town. The nearest one is about 90 minutes away. I usually get one or two a year. But I'm trying to support the league. I buy the Direct Kick package and watch as many of the ESPN2 telecasts as I can. How can any soccer fan in this country do anything else and still call him or herself a soccer fan?