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Budget talks: This is getting nasty

Discussion in 'Sports and News' started by printdust, Jul 13, 2011.

  1. printdust

    printdust New Member

    How many of these were on the Obama campaign promises?
     
  2. printdust

    printdust New Member

    The markets have been reacting this week.
     
  3. Azrael

    Azrael Well-Known Member

    What does that have to do with anything? You asked for solutions. I suggested several.

    This is your response? A non sequitur?
     
  4. CarltonBanks

    CarltonBanks New Member

    Sorry folks...Obama is taking the blame for the downgrade. As well he should. His spending insanity has led to this.
     
  5. YankeeFan

    YankeeFan Well-Known Member

    Government "regulations" about to shut down the artisanal ice cream industry in Illinois.

     
  6. The Big Ragu

    The Big Ragu Moderator Staff Member

    Our national debt under President Bush increased from $5.7 trillion in 2001 to $10.7 trillion at the end of his presidency. Under President Obama it has gone from $10.7 trillion to $14.3 trillion. None of that debt was created unilaterally by a president. It took both houses of Congress, as well. We all share the blame for our debt levels.

    As for the credit downgrade, it's a joke. I am not sure it is even going to have a one or two day effect on yields on U.S. treasuries, because they gave the markets a weekend to digest it. S&P is an absolute joke. The UK's debt to GDP ratio is similar to the U.S., and the U.K. is rated AAA by S&P. France's debt to GDP is similar too, except on top of it, its banks are the most exposed in the world to the toxic debt of close to a half a dozen countries that are on the brink of default. France is in much more precarious shape than the U.S., even if their debt is relatively safe. Their debt is rated AAA by S&P.

    This is a case of S&P trying to make a statement for being made a punching bag by U.S. politicians after the credit default swap meltdown in 2008. But S&P is still a joke. And investors consider them a joke. The yield on a 10-year U.S. treasury note is less than 3 percent. The yield on a 10-year French note is 3.45 percent. I guarantee that will not change because S&P put an arbitrary AA+ on U.S. debt. Investors still know the U.S. is the safer place, which is why yields will remain lower.
     
  7. Ben_Hecht

    Ben_Hecht Active Member

    Good stuff.
     
  8. J Staley

    J Staley Member

    Whether it's meaningful or not, S&P said for the U.S. to keep it's credit rating it had to raise the debt ceiling and come up with a viable plan for dealing with long term debt. A big reason that plan is garbage is because the Tea Party geniuses thought that an agreement to raise the debt ceiling was a compromise on their part, instead of seeing it as a short-term necessity -- as any rational person would.

    To me it sounds like the Tea Party wanted the AAA rating to fall; if they are arguing against one of the provisions that allows the U.S. to keep it, they clearly don't care (though it's certainly possible they didn't comprehend that going in).

    Every legislator deserves blame for this, as well as citizens who let this happen. Obama's included in that mix. But it's very clear to me that the Tea Party specifically, or the government's general sharp right turn led to the score drop.
     
  9. CarltonBanks

    CarltonBanks New Member

    This is only partly true. While Congress voted to spend the money as well, no Republicans voted for Obamacare (the biggest entitlement program in history) and only three voted for the so-called Stimulus. The biggest chunk of federal spending is the result of Obama, Pelosi and Reid jamming through a liberal wish list when the Dems controlled both the Senate and House. And it is unfair to compare how much the deficit increased under Bush to how much it has increased under Obama. Bush had eight years...Obama has out-spent him in less than three.
     
  10. CarltonBanks

    CarltonBanks New Member

    The Tea Party's exists to champion LESS government spending. Not more. If the Tea Party had its wishes the rating would NEVER have been downgraded because we would not be spending so much more than we take in. And you want them to share the blame?
     
  11. YankeeFan

    YankeeFan Well-Known Member

    I half expect S&P to reverse their decision before the "opening of the Asian markets" on Sunday night.

    This will be as a result of the White House pressing them on their numbers.

    No harm. No foul. President Obama is hailed as a hero for saving our credit rating.
     
  12. Baron Scicluna

    Baron Scicluna Well-Known Member

    And for every one of these ridiculous regulations, I could counter with a dozen regulations, or more, about ... mine safety ... Or getting paid for the time you worked, including overtime (even though Bush tried to get rid of that in 2002) ... Or regulations to stop factories from poisioning rivers ... or regulations that make trucking firms give their truckers 8 hours off the road, so you know, they can actually sleep ... or ...

    I can go on. For every ridiculous story of a cop shutting down a kids' lemonade stand, there's plenty of stories throughout this country's history of businesses fighting regulations that are to the benefit of the public and the workers.
     
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