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Chipper: steroid cloud will follow A-Rod

Discussion in 'Sports and News' started by gingerbread, Aug 9, 2007.

  1. lantaur

    lantaur Well-Known Member

    She wrote: "Our Air Force gives fighter jocks "go-pills" to get them through long missions, but we don't refuse to call them heroes because they're on speed." I think the obvious allusion here is to athletes on PEDs or whatever and not calling them heroes. To me, it's a comparison.

    OK, we hold athletes to a different standard. I get that. But she doesn't explore why it is different, but rather gives these anecdotal statements.

    Oh, and I understand what she wrote. I just don't think it was a great column. That doesn't make you wrong; it's just my opinion.
     
  2. Lugnuts

    Lugnuts Well-Known Member

    We also recruit convicted felons for our military.

    We also elected a cokehead president.

    What's her point?
     
  3. The point is that our national attitude towards "drugs" is idiotically ambivalent, morally selective, and socially insane.
     
  4. Lugnuts

    Lugnuts Well-Known Member

    So we care more about sports than we do our military. Again, what's the point?
     
  5. The Big Ragu

    The Big Ragu Moderator Staff Member

    Way mischaracterize what I said. And I know you are much more intelligent than this, Fenian. I am not calling for drug hysteria. This *is* an Era. I am not the one who coined the phrase the "steroid era." And the phrase is not some irrational characterization. It's based on the fact that players discovered these drugs, used them throughout the 90s and into the present and changed the sport's landscape.

    Did you actually read my post... and notice that I wrote it is PATENTLY UNFAIR to accuse A-Rod because there is NO EVIDENCE of his use? What I did say, is that in the current environment it is fair to ask anyone and everyone questions. If that is journalistically unsound, I suggest you just read box scores and forget that for most people sports are about human drama, the means used to achieve accomplishments and the stories that go beyond the hits and runs scored. My point was that there is very compelling evidence that Barry Bonds used that puts it at near certainty for most people. That is why he falls under suspicion. If someone has that kind of evidence of A-Rod's use it needs to be brought to light before what Chipper Jones said has any legitimacy.

    Please don't make up an argument though, attribute it to me and then call it morally obtuse.
     
  6. cranberry

    cranberry Well-Known Member

    Her point, in the face of the ridiculously overblown hysteria surrounding Bonds, is that we haven't done a very good job putting this news in perspective.

    I understand the reaction. The tone of her column probably sound harsh to the hysterics among us. Nonetheless, Sally Jenkins remains one of the top handful of columnists in the country. It's part of her job to make people feel uncomfortable or examine themselves once in a while.
     
  7. BYH

    BYH Active Member

    I will reserve judgment until I see JDV and the voice of Rokski break this down for me on YouTube.
     
  8. zeke12

    zeke12 Guest

    Was that really necessary?








































    That's always the case.
     

  9. I didn't mean to attribute the argument to you, although I can see why you might believe that I had , given the lack of clarity at the top of my post.
    However, this sentence, and its sentiment, is still pretty bad:

    "What I did say, is that in the current environment it is fair to ask anyone and everyone questions."

    Absent anything but suspicion, and the invocation of an "era," it is, in fact, extremely unfair to ask someone if they've broken the law.
     
  10. Lugnuts

    Lugnuts Well-Known Member

    I was being a little sarcastic up there.

    Jenkins is right, of course.

    We let our children play with lead toys imported from China while we go into hysterics about a dog abuser.

    We allow the Vice President of the United States to rip us off to the tune of billions while we take down a shock jock for using an objectionable phrase about a basketball team.

    And yes, we sweat steroids in baseball while crystal meth fuels rapes and killings across the country.

    Her point is such an understatement, it's almost offensive.
     
  11. The Big Ragu

    The Big Ragu Moderator Staff Member

    FB, thanks. :) I really did misunderstand. After you addressed me specifically, I thought you were attributing that to me.

    We are going to agree to disagree on that one point. This isn't a random witch hunt. This isn't walking up to people on the street interrogating them. These guys are public figures, who earn a ton of money, are showered with all kinds of perks, etc. I don't begrudge them one bit. But the price they pay for all the perks is scrutiny the rest of us don't have to deal with. This particular scrutiny would have seemed out of line to anyone with common sense 25 years ago, because it would have been out of left field, so to speak. But the lines of appropriateness have changed.

    PEDs are the biggest issue in baseball. And because of the way baseball itself has handled it and the lies of the players who have used or are using, it is impossible to know who his and who isn't. In that sort of environment, it seems perfectly appropriate to me at least, to have questions--and ask them. You don't have to be an ass about it. You don't have to ambush a guy and demand that he pee in a cup. But if Jose Canseco drops A-Rod's name in a conversation and you are covering that team, you aren't doing your due diligence if you don't immediately walk right up to A-Rod, look him in the eye and ask him pointedly about it. It's not personal. This is the environment in the sport he has chosen to play -- a sport that has given him a lot more in return than the inconvenience of a simple "yes or no" question that really isn't a big deal if the answer is "no."
     
  12. cranberry

    cranberry Well-Known Member

    Baseball (or whatever sport) is the players' job -- not a privilege bestowed upon them. What they get paid and what their perks may be has no place whatsoever in the equation. You don't have more rights or less rights because you're good at what you do.

    Players willingly subject themselves to direct media scrutiny every day not because they like it or because they have some sense of public obligation, but because their employers have requested that they do so in order to help promote and sell their product.
     
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