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David Cone and Orel Hershiser

Discussion in 'Sports and News' started by Dick Whitman, Aug 11, 2011.

  1. MankyJimy

    MankyJimy Active Member

    Hershizer had tremendous advantage, playing in Dodger Stadium in the 1980s. Pitchers park in a pitcher's era. And still barely got to 200 wins (even while playing his twilight years in Cleveland with some great offensive teams - Chuck Nagy could post 5.00 ERA and still win 15 games on those clubs).

    Cone was a more dominant pitcher and his perfecto in 1999 was one of the greatest moments ever.

    There really aren't any deserving, eligible pitchers not in the Hall of Fame. They need to remove Blyleven from the hall. I don't know how he went from fringe/borderline to getting 75% of the vote. He's a disgrace to the hall,
     
  2. MankyJimy

    MankyJimy Active Member

    I've said this before but the electorate needs to re-examine the case of Dave Kingman.
    What an amazing power hitter. He hit 35 homers with 94 RBIs in his final year, if he had been allowed to return in 1987 with the juicy ball I believe Maris' record would have fell a decade early.
     
  3. BrianGriffin

    BrianGriffin Active Member

    True, Dodgers Stadium is a pitcher's park, but I wouldn't say it was the big factor in his dominant stretch because a lot of good pitchers who pitched in that stadium have not had the success he had. What killed him was his torn rotator cuff. If he had doubled up that five-year run, had another season like 85, another like 88 and a couple more years where maybe he's around .500 but he's among the league leaders in ERA or what have you, then he'd be headed to the Hall.

    I don't think he deserves to be in, by any stretch, just saying he was awful good in any park in the somewhat brief period when he was at the top of his game.
     
  4. sgreenwell

    sgreenwell Well-Known Member

    Obvious troll is obvious.
     
  5. sgreenwell

    sgreenwell Well-Known Member

    I think Brown gets hurt by how his career ended, with two mostly meh and miserable years with the Yankees. I almost wonder if he's the JD Drew of pitchers - On the DL a bunch later in his career, and he jumped around a lot from team to team, meaning you're not going to get a groundswell from any specific fan base.

    It is weird how quickly he dropped off the ballot, but my gut instinct is that guys like him, Cone and Hershiser are on the next rung down from the Hall.
     
  6. outofplace

    outofplace Well-Known Member

    Congratulations. You just posted something regarding baseball even more foolish than the Jeter slurping. All he did was hit home runs and he only had 442 of them to go with a .236 batting average and .302 on-base percentage.

    But hey, he does fit in with your habit of ignoring the defensive shortcomings of players you advocate.
     
  7. MankyJimy

    MankyJimy Active Member

    He was one of the best ever at hitting home runs. I realize he wasn't as strong in other areas but I overlook that. I would also vote for Vince Coleman for the HOF.
     
  8. MankyJimy

    MankyJimy Active Member

    I think Kevin Brown belongs in. He was very, very close to being just as good as Pedro Martinez during Pedro's peak years, but without the fanfare:

    Pedro Martinez from 1996-2003: 2.40 ERA, 1624 innings pitched
    Kevin Brown from 1996-2003: 2.60 ERA, 1600 innings pitched
     
  9. Bubbler

    Bubbler Well-Known Member

    I love MankyJimy more than MankyJimy loves Derek Jeter.

    Long live performance art!
     
  10. MankyJimy

    MankyJimy Active Member

    Vince Coleman didn't have a great all-around game but name another player who led his league in a major offensive stat the first 6 year of their career. Coleman led the NL in stolen bases every year from 1985 to 1990. He was also a greater base stealer percentage wise than Henderson.

    I think there's a place in the Hall for players that were that dominant in a particular facet of the game.
     
  11. MankyJimy

    MankyJimy Active Member

    There was an article I read a while back about why Coleman has a case for the Hall. I think it was by Tom Verducci, if I find it I'll post it here.
     
  12. outofplace

    outofplace Well-Known Member

    That doesn't exactly help your argument, though it was beyond help anyway.
     
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