Editors

Well, douche-brain, if you actually read and comprehended what I posted, you might understand that I talk to my writers every day, I discuss story ideas with them every day, I question things in their copy when necessary, I give them feedback on what I think is good or bad every day.
Again, my job is not to make you a better writer. Your job is to become a better writer. I will gladly help you become a better writer by telling you every day what you do well and what you need to work on.
I do not know mindless' situation, but I do know that I work with every writer as much as I can on every story and if mindless worked for me he would not have had to start this thread.

And, again, if you get in my face and try to tell me -- after 35+ years in this business -- how to do my job, it's because you are incapable of doing your job, and your ass is likely out the fucking door tomorrow.

 

Um, the entire thread is about mindless' situation ... you know the guy whose editor doesn't help him .... that's what I was responding to, not your 35 years in the business. I don't remember telling spnited's reporters telling him to fuck off, but after that post it's awfully tempting.

 

Write;

Remember that thread you started, in which you asked for a few nuts and bolts of SportsJournalists.com, as well as for certain things for a newcomer to avoid?

Um...

 

Show me the commandment where it's my fault when someone else doesn't read the thread correctly ... all he has to do is read the quote I was responding to ...

 

Don't listen to spnited, he's got nothin'. Speaking of which, are you ready to lose that sig bet, old man?

 

Funny. I was thinking the same thing. :-\



And back on topic: I was "thrown overboard without a raft" -- I actually prefer the cliche "thrown into the fire" myself -- in dozens of situations my first year in the biz. I was 19 years old, didn't have a single iota of journalism experience. No editing classes, no high school paper, no yearbook, nothing.

When I was 21, I was assigned my first slot shift ... and got a 15-minute crash course the night before from my SE. That was my "training." And you know what? I learned a shitload because of that. Learned from my own mistakes. Watched my colleagues and learned from them. Picked up tricks of the trade from them, and got better that way. Asked my SE questions, paid attention to his critiques, and learned from him. Kept my eyes and ears open every day. Read my paper every day to see what in my stories had been changed.

I didn't expect any help, and if I had, I would have been disappointed. If you get the job, you better fucking learn how to do it on your own. And even more important -- learn how to learn.

Any help you get from anybody but yourself is gravy. Appreciate it.

 

Well, let's see....Mindless' original post was directed to "editors out there" and whether his editor's actions were commonplace or if some of us actually help writers develop story ideas and improve content.
Your reply was:

So who's not responding properly to the thread topic?





Aside to Redd: I think the sig bet is going to be a push (amazingly)! GO CLOTS!

 

write brain - while i help folks who want to be coached up a bit, remember one thing: school is out.

i hand out much more advice than any editor ever gave me. i basically read dave kindred and an awesome local guy growing up and continued reading (and rereading) others i respected when i first entered the biz -- shit, i still do for that matter -- to continue to get better. hell, i have a dozen sporting news' sitting on the back of my toilet (again, absolutely zero disrespect dave) because that's simply where my wife knows to put them and where they'll be best used.

most everybody is up for giving advice if asked, but damn, if you continue to use a square shovel while digging a ditch, maybe you should stop digging ditches and find a new profession.

 

And another thing chapping me here...

This fucking mindset of the SE as Yoda or something.

Guess what? Contrary to what a lot of people in this line of work seem to think, sports writers don't work in sports departments. They work in newsrooms. The SE isn't the only one in the building with wisdom to impart. You have questions? Want to get better? Get to know the people on news-side, too. They, also, happen to be writers, and while your SE may be too busy or ignorant, they may be more willing to be helpful.

I know this could be a shock, since the culture of sports writing centers on the idea of a bunch of guys in their own corner of the newsroom with sports memorabilia plastered all over the place. But if you work at a newspaper, you're part of a team that goes well beyond the sports section. So get to know everybody.

Jesus, this thread has made me crabby.

 

I'm an SE and having to be "Yoda" scares me - I don't feel I have the necessary experience or skill set to be that guy.

I do the best I can in trying to provide feedback and suggestions, but in the end the sports department is a team and you all have to work together, you all have to push each other to be better. Otherwise it's like running on a greasy treadmill.

So, are you sitting back and just expecting people to push you? Or are you pushing someone else as well?

 

I know what you-all are saying. I've been there, too. I wasn't out of high school two months when I was pushed out the door to cover my first murder trial - fyi Kaylee, I'm a news reporter first and always - I learned through doing and making mistakes, which is always the best way. And I'm at the point now where my basic need from an editor is to make a decision and make it fast and I'll do it exactly the way they want it. And when I'm not doing that, I'm helping the increasingly large number of kids coming straight in from college just cuz I want to.
Point understood.
But, lord, there are a lot of crappy editors in this industry that do a lot of damage ... in my career I've seen a lot of talented writers leave because of the head games that are played on them. And I'm almost certain that these editors were millions of times worse than any of the guys I've offended on this thread. You guys probably say, so what?, but you got a bunch of these young guys in one or two-man departments being told wrong info coming to this board crying out for help because they're not getting any feedback - and what, they shouldn't demand a little help? Just take it like in the old days? If the editor's job is to put out the best possible paper, isn't part of that making sure his reporter is doing the best job possible? I may be a bit uppity, sure, but I'm a reporter. If I'm out there in the streets trying to a/effect change for everyone else why can't I call for it in my own job/industry?

 

For what it's worth, the feedback I get at my shop is a check every two weeks. I guess as long as I get that, I'm doing something right.