FROM 2012 INTO 2013 POLITICS THREAD

cranberry · Nov 5, 2012

Re: THE 2012 POLITICS THREAD

Baron Scicluna said:

RickStain said:

Inky_Wretch said:

Romney avoided $100m in taxes?

http://politicalwire.com/archives/2012/11/05/romney_avoided_taxes_through_netherlands.html
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Good for him if he did.
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Gotta love his patriotism.
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There used to be a time when "tax dodger" had a negative connotation.

Dick Whitman · Nov 5, 2012

Re: THE 2012 POLITICS THREAD

Azrael said:

hondo said:

Azrael said:

RickStain said:

Inky_Wretch said:

Romney avoided $100m in taxes?

http://politicalwire.com/archives/2012/11/05/romney_avoided_taxes_through_netherlands.html
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Good for him if he did.
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And yet Capone went to prison for the same thing.
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Capone paid zero taxes and didn't contribute anything to charity. Nice try, however.
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hondo said:

Inky_Wretch said:

Romney avoided $100m in taxes?

http://politicalwire.com/archives/2012/11/05/romney_avoided_taxes_through_netherlands.html
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Fuckin' A. I'd rather charities get the money than the government.
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Why assume charities are getting any of that money?

Doesn't Mitt Romney owe the same obligation to America that America expects of us all?
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He followed the tax laws as they are written. That's his obligation - and ours.

This is a non-controversy.

hondo · Nov 5, 2012

Re: THE 2012 POLITICS THREAD

Azrael said:

hondo said:

Azrael said:

RickStain said:

Inky_Wretch said:

Romney avoided $100m in taxes?

http://politicalwire.com/archives/2012/11/05/romney_avoided_taxes_through_netherlands.html
Click to expand...

Good for him if he did.
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And yet Capone went to prison for the same thing.
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Capone paid zero taxes and didn't contribute anything to charity. Nice try, however.
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Capone paid partial taxes - and hid the off-the-books money in banks. He also gave lavishly to charity.
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What charities? The Italian Anti-Defamation League? The FOP, who was in cahoots with him?

RickStain · Nov 5, 2012

Re: THE 2012 POLITICS THREAD

Azrael said:

Capone paid partial taxes - and hid the off-the-books money in banks. He also gave lavishly to charity.
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His mistake was not getting enough like-minded rich people elected to Congress to change the rules to make his off-shoring legal.

GeorgeFHayek · Nov 5, 2012

Re: THE 2012 POLITICS THREAD

Azrael said:

Where in the founding literature of this country is "self-interest" promoted as a means or an end?

"Self-interest" may or may not be a bedrock principle of capitalism or a market economy, but the "common good" would seem to me a basic premise of democratic government.
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Economic liberty was of paramount importance to the founders. Check out the state constitutions of several of the original colonies-become-states:

From New Hampshire: "All men have certain natural, essential, and inherent rights - among which are, the enjoying and defending [of] life and liberty; acquiring, possessing, and protecting, property; ..."

From Massachusetts: "All men are born free and equal, and have certain natural, essential, and unalienable rights; among which may be reckoned the right of enjoying and defending their lives and liberties; that of acquiring, possessing, and protecting property; ..."

From North Carolina: "We hold it to be self-evident that all persons are created equal; that they are endowed by their Creator with certain inalienable rights; that among these are life, liberty, the enjoyment of the fruits of their own labor ..."

From Virginia: "[A]ll men ... have certain inherent rights of which . . . they cannot deprive or divest their posterity; namely, the enjoyment of life and liberty, with the means of acquiring and possessing property ..."

This emphasis on economic liberty was written into those constitutions by the same people who'd been put off by Jefferson leaving it out of his preamble to the Declaration.

Azrael · Nov 5, 2012

Re: THE 2012 POLITICS THREAD

RickStain said:

Azrael said:

Why assume charities are getting any of that money?

Doesn't Mitt Romney owe the same obligation to America that America expects of us all?

Wasn't it America that afforded Mitt Romney his chance to succeed in his own "self-interest?"
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If you want him to pay more taxes, change the laws.

Unless you can prove he did something illegal, there's nothing wrong with moving money around to try to avoid taxes. It's no morally different than taking a deduction on your 1040EZ.
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You'll need the 1040 longform if you choose to itemize.

Dick Whitman · Nov 5, 2012

Re: THE 2012 POLITICS THREAD

The speed limit on my drive home is 70 mph.

Should I drive 60 instead because it seems like the right thing to do?

Or should I trust the lawmakers to set the speeding laws?

Captain Obvious · Nov 5, 2012

Re: THE 2012 POLITICS THREAD

Aren't their rumors Romney took advantage of an IRS amnesty?

hondo · Nov 5, 2012

Re: THE 2012 POLITICS THREAD

Dick Whitman said:

Azrael said:

hondo said:

Azrael said:

RickStain said:

Inky_Wretch said:

Romney avoided $100m in taxes?

http://politicalwire.com/archives/2012/11/05/romney_avoided_taxes_through_netherlands.html
Click to expand...

Good for him if he did.
Click to expand...

And yet Capone went to prison for the same thing.
Click to expand...

Capone paid zero taxes and didn't contribute anything to charity. Nice try, however.
Click to expand...

hondo said:

Inky_Wretch said:

Romney avoided $100m in taxes?

http://politicalwire.com/archives/2012/11/05/romney_avoided_taxes_through_netherlands.html
Click to expand...

Fuckin' A. I'd rather charities get the money than the government.
Click to expand...

Why assume charities are getting any of that money?

Doesn't Mitt Romney owe the same obligation to America that America expects of us all?
Click to expand...

He followed the tax laws as they are written. That's his obligation - and ours.

This is a non-controversy.
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But they're doing their best to paint a guy as a criminal for following the law.
Guy still paid way more taxes than most people. And gave way more to charity than most people. Guess this is what the libs resort to when they can't find a DUI on his record that had been fixed.

GeorgeFHayek · Nov 5, 2012

Re: THE 2012 POLITICS THREAD

cranberry said:

There used to be a time when "tax dodger" had a negative connotation.
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Still means the same thing ... someone who breaks the law vis-a-vis his/her taxes.

old_tony · Nov 5, 2012

Re: THE 2012 POLITICS THREAD

YankeeFan said:

Azrael said:

YankeeFan said:

Azrael said:

Not sure how any of what you posted relates to the specific story I linked.
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My point is that if say Sanchez or Karpinski had been fired, there would have been a political shit storm.
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So? There have been political consequences to military staffing decisions for 2500 years.
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OK. That's a fair point. But, I think politicians would prefer to avoid the controversy when possible, and the results can be pretty bad because of it.

Let's look at something else too. Does America demand excellence anywhere today?

Do we demand it from teachers (or students)? Do we demand it from politicians or factory workers?

People criticize Stuyvesant High School for being too Asian, and relying strictly on a test for admission.

Unions defend against firing (or even ranking/grading) poor teachers.

We don't keep score in youth soccer games.

Is it any wonder that mediocrity has become the norm in the military and the Academies?
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Hell, for the last four years mediocrity would have been an IMPROVEMENT in the White House.

Baron Scicluna · Nov 5, 2012

Re: THE 2012 POLITICS THREAD

Dick Whitman said:

Also: You can't stand up for Warren Buffett when Republicans say he's a hypocrite for not paying more taxes out of the goodness of his heart, then criticize Mitt Romney for essentially doing the same things as Warren Buffett.
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Actually, if you'll recall, Buffett made an offer to Republicans to match dollar-for-dollar any extra contributions to the government to pay down the deficit, and three dollars for every dollar for Mitch McConnell.

http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-503544_162-57357816-503544/warren-buffett-throws-down-financial-challenge-to-gop/

If I remember right, only one Republican took him up on his offer.

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