FROM 2012 INTO 2013 POLITICS THREAD

LongTimeListener · Oct 3, 2012

Re: THE 2012 POLITICS THREAD

hondo said:

LongTimeListener said:

Hokie_pokie said:

LongTimeListener said:

Just saw the clip where Romney cites the $716 million figure for Obama cutting Medicare. This is a lie. It isn't a different interpretation, it isn't a half-truth, it isn't anything that can be couched. It is a lie. And the Romney campaign has been told publicly that it's a lie and they really haven't mounted any defense to the charge that it's a lie.

So I guess it's winning to get more people to like you more than they did before the thing started, but it's a lie. A lie. And it needs to be called such.
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LTL, please tell me you aren't seriously whining about a politican lying. Please.

We all know the truth is just an innocent bystander in this fucked-up process, and has been for a long time.
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There are distortions and half-truths and new claims that haven't been vetted.

There is rarely a known flat-out lie that is repeated so often and so forcefully in such a format.

Saying "they all lie" just works to the advantage of the guy who makes lies the central feature of his campaign. Which I suppose is the angle the Romney camp is playing.
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Some of you guys need to understand the difference between an interpretation of a particular policy (yours and the other side's spin on yours, and vice versa) ... in effect, the sales pitch ... and lying. One other thing is that you can make statistics and numbers say any damn thing you want.
When Bud says on a commercial that it's the greatest beer in the world, is it true? No, of course not. But are they lying? No ... they're selling.
Politics is selling. We'll see in November who had the best sales pitch.
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Not a matter of interpretation. Not selling. Something that is factually false.

A lie.

Mark2010 · Oct 4, 2012

Re: THE 2012 POLITICS THREAD

Lies. Damned lies. And statistics.

Care Bear · Oct 4, 2012

Re: THE 2012 POLITICS THREAD

SockPuppet said:

Jim Lehrer needs to retire. Moderators need to be in control and be brief.

Also, there needs to be a system where the candidates are buzzed, beeped or blasted to STFU when they're either rambling or off topic or not answering the question or saying something without backing it up with facts.
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If that's the case we need to find a few mute kids to stand in for the candidates.

hondo · Oct 4, 2012

Re: THE 2012 POLITICS THREAD

YankeeFan said:

LongTimeListener said:

YankeeFan said:

Epic Chris Mathews meltdown.
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How can you tell? He has always seemed like a guy who angrily screams that he wants burgers, fries and a shake.
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Care Bear said:

YankeeFan said:

Epic Chris Mathews meltdown.
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Are you forecasting that or it's actually happening?
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Oh, it's real, and it's really epic.

He's so mad at Obama.

I tried to type out some highlights someplace else, but I couldn't keep up.
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I know it's a liberal network and Matthews is going to have his spin. But he's acting like a homer blogger from Bessemer, Ala., who's pissed off the Tide lost a game. Matthews talked as if he was actually an Obama advisor chewing the boss out after the debate. Christ, go ahead and shill for the guy. Hannity is doing the same thing on the other network. But throwing a tantrum like this is borderline deranged. I would watch MSNBC more if Matthews and Sharpton weren't on the air. The others are at least credible and smart, especially Maddow. I actually enjoy listening to her side of it.
If Romney wins in November, Matthews is either going to jump of a building or punch a blow-up Obama doll on the air.

Mark2010 · Oct 4, 2012

Re: THE 2012 POLITICS THREAD

You know, I made a lot more money last year than I did during the Reagan years.

Never mind that rent, gas, groceries and everything else is a hell of a lot more expensive, too. But, hey, my salary has quadrupled in 25 years.

Everything's relative.

Uncle.Ruckus · Oct 4, 2012

Re: THE 2012 POLITICS THREAD

A Romney adviser just admitted Romney's plan won't cover preexisting conditions.

hondo · Oct 4, 2012

Re: THE 2012 POLITICS THREAD

LongTimeListener said:

hondo said:

LongTimeListener said:

Hokie_pokie said:

LongTimeListener said:

Just saw the clip where Romney cites the $716 million figure for Obama cutting Medicare. This is a lie. It isn't a different interpretation, it isn't a half-truth, it isn't anything that can be couched. It is a lie. And the Romney campaign has been told publicly that it's a lie and they really haven't mounted any defense to the charge that it's a lie.

So I guess it's winning to get more people to like you more than they did before the thing started, but it's a lie. A lie. And it needs to be called such.
Click to expand...

LTL, please tell me you aren't seriously whining about a politican lying. Please.

We all know the truth is just an innocent bystander in this fucked-up process, and has been for a long time.
Click to expand...

There are distortions and half-truths and new claims that haven't been vetted.

There is rarely a known flat-out lie that is repeated so often and so forcefully in such a format.

Saying "they all lie" just works to the advantage of the guy who makes lies the central feature of his campaign. Which I suppose is the angle the Romney camp is playing.
Click to expand...

Some of you guys need to understand the difference between an interpretation of a particular policy (yours and the other side's spin on yours, and vice versa) ... in effect, the sales pitch ... and lying. One other thing is that you can make statistics and numbers say any damn thing you want.
When Bud says on a commercial that it's the greatest beer in the world, is it true? No, of course not. But are they lying? No ... they're selling.
Politics is selling. We'll see in November who had the best sales pitch.
Click to expand...

Not a matter of interpretation. Not selling. Something that is factually false.

A lie.
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Well, you're trying to sell me that Romney lied. I don't agree. Just because you say it's a lie don't make it so.

Uncle.Ruckus · Oct 4, 2012

Re: THE 2012 POLITICS THREAD

OH MY GOD!!! OBAMA IS FUCKED!!!! THIS ONE'S OVER!!!!!!

Um, not so much.

More on empathy: Poll shows 69% say Pres Obama cares about their needs and problems - up from 53% before debate.
— @markknoller via web
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silver lining for Obama in post-debate poll: fave/unfave numbers for both candidates mostly unchanged.
— @PeterHambyCNN via web
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Uncle.Ruckus · Oct 4, 2012

Re: THE 2012 POLITICS THREAD

hondo said:

Well, you're trying to sell me that Romney lied. I don't agree. Just because you say it's a lie don't make it so.
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Does a Romney adviser admitting Romney lied about preexisting conditions count as a lie?

exmediahack · Oct 4, 2012

Re: THE 2012 POLITICS THREAD

I think this does show Obama's weakness when confronted. He thrives on friendly crowds, college gyms, softball questions. This is the first real campaign where he isn't treated as some special man with "great upside". Politically speaking, Obama is like the 5-0 college football team that won four I-AA games to open the season and won the conference opener at home against a second-division team (McCain).

Romney's record as a candidate isn't spectacular. But he won Massachusetts and survived a nasty primary where he didn't get a free ride from the media.

When Obama is taken, not as a celebrity but as a man with a record, he struggles.

Mark2010 · Oct 4, 2012

Re: THE 2012 POLITICS THREAD

I realize Lehrer lost control of the debate early on. But it was sort of nice to hear the two candidates go back and forth on issues, arguing different points, point counterpoint.

I understand the economy is the top issue and worthy of its own debate, but I do hope at some point they get to discuss some of the other domestic issues (immigration, social issues, gun control, education, environment, etc.) as well.

hondo · Oct 4, 2012

Re: THE 2012 POLITICS THREAD

Mark2010 said:

You know, I made a lot more money last year than I did during the Reagan years.

Never mind that rent, gas, groceries and everything else is a hell of a lot more expensive, too. But, hey, my salary has quadrupled in 25 years.

Everything's relative.
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Could the simple reason be that the last Reagan year was 1988 (24 years ago) and you've been in the work force 24 years longer, have gotten promoted, gotten raises or moved up to better jobs?

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