Happy 65th Bobby Orr, the greatest hockey player ever

cyclingwriter · Mar 23, 2013

Ian Hunter? Wasn't he Dale Hunter's brother?

Ben_Hecht · Mar 23, 2013

JR said:

Gehrig said:

I still disagree that he's better than Gretzky, but he was such a joy to watch.

There's five players that I was very fortunate to watch and those are:

-Maurice Richard
-Gordie Howe
-Jean Beliveau
-Wayne Gretzky
-Bobby Orr

Made the game look so simple.
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Saw all of them as well and I still maintain that he's the best ever. Gretzky had uncanny vision but Orr was a better skater, had a better shot and if he hadn't been derailed by those damn knees, who would know what records he would have set .

Love Gretzky but Orr was the ultimate skill player---and also one tough SOB. No one fought him because they knew he'd clean their clock.
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Gordie Howe.

Turn out the lights, when you leave.

Versatile · Mar 23, 2013

Ben_Hecht said:

Gordie Howe.

Turn out the lights, when you leave.
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You've convinced me.

JC · Mar 23, 2013

Fly said:

JC said:

Fly said:

JC said:

Double J said:

Howe did have the greatest career - 32 years of pro hockey, and I don't care that six of those years were in the WHA, it was still major league. And then he played all 80 games in his last NHL season, scoring 15 goals at age 51-52.

Gretzky couldn't even hit double digits in his last season, at age 37-38. Don't give me any crap about dead-puck era - Rangers teammate Todd Harvey, who in 671 career games didn't score as many goals as Gretzky got in 1981-82 alone, managed to outscore the Great One that final year.
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Howe did not have the greatest career, not by a longshot and to scoff at the difference in eras is crazy. Gretzky was still close to a point a game player in his last year in a far more difficult league to get points in. This is not minimize Howe, he is a great hockey player but what Gretzky did in the 80's is far more impressive than anything Howe did.
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icardfacepalm:
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Are you kidding me? The late 90's was the height of the dead puck era. The goaltending alone was ten times as good.

There isn't another position in sports that is improved over the last 40 years like goaltending in hockey. Go back and look at some clips from the 60's, 70's and even the 80's the goaltending is laughable compared to the last 15 years.
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Yep the great Steve Shields, Roman Turek, Jamie McLennan and Byron Dafoe (all of whom put up eye-popping numbers for at least one season) were miles ahead of the goalies of the late 60s-early 70s.

No doubt the position was in a state of change, but that was also the height of clutch-and-grab defense. Still, if you compare the goal/point totals as a whole in those eras they're somewhat comparable, with the exception of the major outlier that was Phil Esposito's goal-scoring (and the Bruins as a whole as they led the league in goals for several consecutive years in the late 60s-early 70s, including potting 100+ more than any other team in 70-71) during those few years. Maybe his name should be mentioned amongst those whose peak was unbelievably high. His 70-71 campaign was tremendous beyond words- 76 goals and the next closest pursuer had 51 (Johnny Bucyck). Orr, who finished 2nd in scoring (102 assists), won the Hart but Espo was unstoppable near the net (due largely in part to Orr creating so many chances for him). Only four 100+ point scorers, all of whom played for the high-flying Bruins.

I think in many ways we're "arguing" similar points. I completely understand people who say Gretzky is the best ever due to his prolific numbers. I'm just saying that as more teams joined the league (despite the addition of additional player streams from around the world), more players who had no business playing in the league began playing in the league. And that "back in the day" guys in the minors had a tough time making it to the Show due to the fact there were so few jobs to be won (Johnny Bower not getting a full shot in the NHL until age 34, other than one season with the Rangers several years earlier yet became an NHL HoFer). Therefore I feel the level of play overall was better then. If you disagree, fine; you have that right.

The only position, IMO, that has improved over time is goalie. Advanced coaching, better equipment (imagine the big goalies of today having to use leather pads filled with horsehide, that by the end of games weighed about 30+ pounds each rather than these light-weight water-resistant ones today) and overall better physical training (which has improved across the board not only in hockey but in all sports as we've learned about nutrition, weight training, etc...plus the salaries allow players of today to train year round, rather than having to take a second job to make ends meet in the off season). Things would be drastically different, just as the composite stick has changed the position up front (nearly everyone can rocket the puck, rather than having to learn proper shooting technique).

Old dude stepping off soapbox now.

EDIT: I am SO glad my 1000th post was arguing the merits of Gordie Howe!!!
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Yes, every single one of those goalies are a thousand times better than John Garrett and his compadres. Google goalies of the 70's, you'll have a great laugh.

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Happy 65th Bobby Orr, the greatest hockey player ever

cyclingwriter Active Member

Ben_Hecht Active Member

Versatile Active Member

JC Well-Known Member

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Happy 65th Bobby Orr, the greatest hockey player ever

cyclingwriter Active Member

Ben_Hecht Active Member

Versatile Active Member

JC Well-Known Member

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