Israel airstrike kills 34 children and 12 others

Yep. Kill 'em all. Let God sort 'em out.

 

chuck, i agree with you. those children did nothing. but when it's so-called muslims like hezbollah firing rockets from rooms next to those children, what do you wan Israel to do? I'm not saying it's fair, but it's the situation those children are put in - by the terrorists. if those people don't like it, or condone it, then they should fucking do something about it. instead, they seem to embrace hezbollah - which is a part of the damn government, yet has its own army. if those people don't want to see more innocents kill, then they too must fight the real reason behind this.

 

That may be where Chuck is getting hung up. I mean you no disrespect at all Chuck, but it seems you keep looking for fairness and decency. That is how you live your life and how those around you live theirs.

Hezbollah is not playing by any of the rules that you have grown up learning. Their sense of what is right and what is wrong is somewhat askew from yours.

In the past, Israel has tried not lowering themselves to that level and it hasn't done any good. They have tried almost every solution offered by the world community and none has worked.

I was listening to a talk sshow host last weekend who was making the flat out statement: "Israel must negotiate with Hezbollah. They have to find out what Hezbollah wants and work on negotiating from there". A caller said that what Hezbollah wants is for every Jew to be dead. The question for the host was "How do you negotiate from there?

My personal feeling is that I don't think you can. Israel tried.

Just my two cents.

P.S. (and I don't mean to threadjack) Congratulations on your recent graduation. Have you chosen a college yet?

 

Terrorists are very similar to cults. An example is the story of Mohammed Atta. Atta was one of the hijackers in the World Trade Center attacks. I don't blame Atta or any of the other hijackers. I blame Bin Laden and the other leaders. Atta was a engineer. He was a average joe. At one point in life, he felt very low because of some sort of depression. And who was there to "ease the pain"? Al Qaeda of course. They take in people who have hit rock bottom in their lives and make them think that the only way to make things better is if you go out there and blow yourself up. But that's just one of the many reasons why Muslims in the overseas have a hate towards America. Another reason is the fact that the Arabs used to be at the top of the class. They used to be "America". But they're not that anymore. And, of the course, the Arab media dosn't help at all. They only add to the fire. They fill these people with lies upon lies about what goes on in America. An example would be this headline on a newspaper "America actually fixed 9/11". The only Arab media that, I think, actually tells the truth is the media in the Untied Arab Emirates. They actually do the dirty work and find the truth.

 

can't disagree with you again. the children there are taught to hate, in schools and by everyone it seems. it's sad that a people that I am sure have a lot to offer feel the only way they can be heard is to blow themselves up in the middle of a large crowd of people. they are truly brainwashed. Chuck, do you feel that moederate muslims do enough to speak out against these radicals? just interested on your take. PM if you want.

 

Thank you. And I've been thinking about going to either Northwestern or Michigan. But by the looks of it, I think I'll be headed to Ann Arbor.

 

I think the Muslims in America do a good job in teaching the kids about peace. The Muslims overseas are sort of a different animal. But I'd like to say that there are some Muslims in the overseas that aren't "brainwashed". My aunt lives in a Middle Eastern country and I visited her last winter. During that time, I found a gym were I thought I could go and play some basketball. There were many kids that were my age and all of them were real cool. I told them that I came from America and no one really hated me. They actually embraced me. If people in the US could meet those types of kids, they would understand that not all Muslims are terrorists. I asked them many questions about 9/11. One person gave me a very interesting answer. He said "9/11 was terrible and I felt very bad for all the people that were effected by it. But I think there were positives that came out from 9/11. I think it gave America a glimpse of what happens over here day after day after day."

 

Israel had every right to defend itself. Hezbollah kidnapped two soldiers and provoked this war. While I find the high number of civilian casualties and the bombing of the U.N. peacekeepers revolting, these things are an unfortunate consequence of war. I'll give you all this.

But I think this will backfire on Israel and the U.S. in the long run.

For one, as many have noted on this thread already, Israel has done the equivalent of leveling an entire house to deal with a cockroach problem. The response has been disproportionate. While they have a right to defend themselves, remember that Reagan pulled our troops out of Lebanon after the Marines were bombed there. We didn't blast the entire country into the Stone Age.

Lebanon was a fledgling democracy -- isn't this what we want in Iraq and the Middle East? -- and this war has undermined a Lebanese administration only in office for a little more than a year. These strikes have decimated the Lebanese economy, which will serve to radicalize its populace.  Yes, the Lebanese govt could have done a better job reigning in Hezbollah, but a U.N. international peace-keeping force might have been able to help in this regard as the young govt established its legitimacy and gained leverage.

Moreso, this has strained relations between the U.S. and Egypt, Saudi Arabia and Jordan. Bush already has a credibility problem thanks to the Iraq farce, and his refusal to so much as urge a cease-fire in the last few days will weaken those relations further and inflame anti-US sentiment in the Arab world.

So yeah, Israel has every right to defend itself. But I just feel like a more limited strike aimed at getting its soldiers back followed by U.N. intervention -- at least attempting it -- would have been more productive than blowing a potential new friendly regime in the region into smithereens.

 

So how does getting their soldiers back stop Hizbollah from shooting at them? They were doing that before the soldiers were kidnapped.

 

Apparently, they're moving missiles via UN refugee camps and UN peacekeepers as well (at least, that would account for those targets being hit).[/sarcasm]
Frankly, I don't care if CNN reported the use of ambulances was widespread. Those targets with the big red crosses on them are off limits. Period. Because, whether Hezbollah is using some of them or not, there's a much greater chance that innocents are being transported. That's the burden of being a civilized nation.

Guys, all I'm trying to say is let's not jump to jingoistic sides in this confrontation. The Lebanese gov't (elected just recently, by the way, so the "years of indifference" argument needs to be tossed) was an inroads to peace in that particular region. That chance my be gone. Hezbollah does insanely indefensible things. They also do some good -- aid to entire areas of Lebanon. Israel does good things. They're also capable of insanely indefensible things.

This calls for much, much more complex solutions than "light 'em up."

 

The UN has done next to nothing in this situation until now! NOTHING!!! Where were they the last few years while hezbollah stockpiled weapons near the border in preparation to fire them into Israel? answer that...

as for Chuck, thank your for your insight to this. i have spent time over in the middle east and realize that not all muslims are bad. i think sometimes we rush to generalize a people based on a certain few bad ones.

 

When dealing with animals sometimes you have to act like one.

It's not Israel's fault they are killing civilians. It's Hizbollah's fault for being a bunch of cowardly fucks who use women and children as human shields and basically offer them up for slaughter by firing at Israel from homes, schools and mosques.

Israel isn't shooting at houses for shits and grins. They're shooting at houses because that's where Hizbollah is firing from.

Hizbollah, Hamas, Syria and Iran want Israel destroyed. The only way Israel will ever have peace is by destroying those groups first.

Cease fires and peace plans are useless when one side will settle for nothing other than the total destruction of the other side.