It's Watch!... Neighborhood Watch. Not shoot.

There is still a ton of information yet to come out about all of this.
It seems like many people initially had very visceral knee-jerk reactions based on little or no real information.
Now that the information that is trickling out seems to call into question a lot of the knee-jerking, people are invested in simply being right and saving face. Not a good posture for meaningful dialogue...

 

Seems to me like one wanted to be the tough guy (Martin) and one wanted to play the tough cop (Zimmerman). Martin did what a lot of testosterone-fueled teenagers would do and confronted a guy who was clearly following him. Both may or may not have said something to escalate the situation, and the fight ensued. I have a problem with Zimmerman carrying the gun and shooting the kid during the fight, but because he was legally carrying it and the Stand Your Ground law exists, I don't see any way he is convicted. Sad story, and there's no reason for the kid to be dead. Just another reason I think guns are nothing but trouble.

 

What disingenuous crap. Everything you have posted on here points to Zimmerman being the victim, doing nothing but sitting in his van and following police orders as Martin comes after him. That you are doing it under the guise of trying to lead a calm, rational look at these "facts" only makes you look more biased.

 

Perhaps you could go back and reread the beginning paragraph of my initial post about all of this.
I never said that "Zimmerman is at fault for this killing" because it isn't that simple. That is the point that I have been trying to make. Life is generally not that neat and tidy. It isn't that black and white. There is a ton of gray in this whole sad story but people like you can't seem to tolerate any ambiguity. "White man with gun, bad!" You sound like a petulant child. You aren't going to force me into discussing the situation on your level.

The five facts I posted are open for discussion. That's why I posted them on a message board. Which facts do you question? I infer from those facts that the dominant characterization of GZ as gun-toting racist instigator stalker may need to be revisited. Do you agree/disagree? On what basis?

I infer from those facts that TM had the opportunity to go into his house and instead chose to go to where GZ was. For what purpose? To what end? I haven't heard this facet discussed so I posted it here. Would TM be alive today eating skittles if he simply went into his house? Probably... doesn't mean he "deserved" anything.

Here's the thing. I can put myself into both individual's shoes and see how they each thought that they were completely in the right. What you call "setting things into motion" and "playing cop" I think there could be reasonable explanations for. Is it so inconceivable that both individuals, while thinking that they were each doing the right thing, may have contributed in their own way to the tragic outcome?

 

I don't think GZ is a "victim." I believe even a semi-close reading of my posts bear that out.

Look at the link posted to the NY Times map/911 transcript. There appears to be a very definite moment where GZ is moving away from TM to a specific place to meet the police. TM goes in the opposite direction of the house he is staying at and instead goes toward where GZ is. Is that worth noting? I think so. Do these observations perhaps call into question the notion of GZ hunting this young man down and killing him in cold blood? Maybe. Do you disagree? What are your reasons?

I love how attempting to have a reasonable discussion makes me look "more biased."
Biased toward theories fitting facts?

 

Your whole history on this board consists of two topics:

1) Kobe Bryant's inalienable right to use the word "faggot."

2) George Zimmerman was sitting in his van minding his own business when Trayvon Martin attacked him.

I know what you're about. So your silliness means nothing more to me.

 

I totally agree. I bought a pistol a few years back. Had it in my house for a few months and it just didn't sit well with me and I sold it. I didn't feel safer for having it in my house. Even though it was locked up I didn't like having it in the house with my kids either. Just a weird unsettling feeling. It's a big frickin deal to own a gun...

 

You have outed me.

Now that you have totally misrepresented my actual positions on the two issues I contributed my two cents to you can summarily dismiss me and those opinions. Nice work. Excellent ad hominem. What other avoidance techniques do you employ with those you disagree with? So if I had a thousand posts on The Walking Dead, NASCAR, the best album of the 90's and the NHL playoff running thread would my opinions be more valid? Who is being silly? You have posted over 8,000 times on a variety of threads and it hasn't helped you say a cogent thing yet on this issue.

I love sports and love lurking here. When discussions veer into societal issues they veer into my line of work and every so often, when I think people are being very ridiculous, I strike! Beware if you bring up abortion or Cuban cigars. You have been warned...

 

If I was sitting on this jury, the evidence I would really want to see is the position on the man and the boy when the shot was fired.

If TM is kicking GZ's ass, and GZ pulls the gun out, does TM back up or stop fighting? Is there distance between the two? IF TM is activly kicking GZ ass and the weapon is discharged before Martin can see it or stop fighting, this will help GZ case. If TM sees the gun and stops fighting or is on his back when the shot is fired, then GZ should be in jail after the trail.



This is the gun GZ used. Unless he had a round chambered before the fight started, there is no way he would have been able to chamber a round, which takes both hands, if TM is kicking his ass.

I have a feeling the TM saw the gun, backed up, which means stopped fighting, and GM killed him.

 

This thread -- no,THIS BOARD -- would be lost without you serving as a referee. Posters surely wait on pins and needles to hear your thoughtful critiques.

 

I know. It's a wonderful feeling.

 

If you're losing a fistfight to a kid 11 years younger than you, it's cool to shoot him in the heart. Stand your ground people.