Maddux, Glavine, Thomas elected to Baseball Hall of Fame; Biggio just misses

Re: 2014 BBWAA Baseball Hall of Fame ballot released

Nah. You actually didn't.

 

Re: 2014 BBWAA Baseball Hall of Fame ballot released

 

Re: 2014 BBWAA Baseball Hall of Fame ballot released

By the way, here is the clarification to my initial question that Dick is ignoring so he can be a troll.

 

Re: 2014 BBWAA Baseball Hall of Fame ballot released

You weren't "still waiting" for an answer to that question, as you had yet to ask it before then.

 

Re: 2014 BBWAA Baseball Hall of Fame ballot released

 

Re: 2014 BBWAA Baseball Hall of Fame ballot released

I loved Mussina when he was on the Orioles (being an Orioles fan), hated him when he went to the Yankees (of course). I always thought he was good, very good, sometimes great .. but not a Hall of Famer. I wonder if he played his entire career with the O's or didn't go to NY if people would even talk about him as a HOFer.

As it is, he was better in Baltimore (147-81, .645, 3.53, ERA+130) than New York (123-72, .631, 3.88, ERA+114). I don't have the time (or too lazy) to look up his 3-2 losses, etc., but I'm guessing that wasn't the case, especially based on his record and the fact the O's were a good team for much of his career there.

 

Re: 2014 BBWAA Baseball Hall of Fame ballot released

I think both Glavine and Mussina should be locks. No doubt in my mind that they're both Hall of Famers.

Was Mussina ever the No. 1 pitcher in his league? No, but it's not his fault he had Randy Johnson, Roger Clemens and Pedro Martinez in the same league during his entire career. But Glavine was only ever a clear-cut No. 1 in one season, 1991. (And it's not his fault he was in the same league with Greg Maddux the whole time.)

I hate turning this into a Glavine vs. Mussina comparison ... but if you look at their five or seven or 10 best seasons — aka, their "primes" — Mussina is virtually even with (or even slightly ahead of) Glavine. Mussina allowed far fewer baserunners, struck out more batters (in 900 fewer innings), and played in a tougher league, tougher run environment, and tougher home ballparks than Glavine.

If Glavine is in, there's no reason Mussina shouldn't be in, too.

 

Re: 2014 BBWAA Baseball Hall of Fame ballot released

You left out giving up significantly more runs during their "primes." Mussina had better peripheral statistics, but Glavine was better at the one that matters most.

Also, you started off talking about primes, then you went into career numbers. (including Glavine pitching 900 more innings). Higher career strikeouts doesn't belong in a comparison of the players' primes. (I grant that Mussina had better peripheral numbers, but in this type of evaluation, peripheral is a good word for them.)

Glavine was pretty lousy at the start of his career and the end. That is part of why it is important to take into account nearly 900 more innings pitched. Otherwise, Glavine is penalized for his longevity without being properly credited with simply producing at the major league level for a good bit longer than Mussina.

 

Re: 2014 BBWAA Baseball Hall of Fame ballot released

Mussina had a reputation for being a miserable prick. I know voters haven't held that against guys who are no-brainer selections (Carlton), but some have speculated that others (Rice) might have had to wait longer because writers didn't like them.

I wonder if that factors in at all here.

 

Re: 2014 BBWAA Baseball Hall of Fame ballot released

I wonder if the handful of assholes who will keep Maddux off their ballots will send in their votes to this place.

 

Re: 2014 BBWAA Baseball Hall of Fame ballot released

I doubt it. That would be asking for too much courage from the valiant defenders of the Hall of Fame.

 

Re: 2014 BBWAA Baseball Hall of Fame ballot released

So, Murray Chass left Biggio off his ballot due to steriod suspicions.

http://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/2013/12/26/murray-chass-thinks-craig-biggio-did-steroids/

Seriously, has anyone ever said they thought Biggio did steroids? I know he was a teammate of Ken Caminiti, but still ...