Most overrated baseball player of all time

The league ERA for Maddux's career: 4.15
Maddux: 3.01

The league ERA for Ryan's career: 3.57
Ryan: 3.19

Please try again. And, yes, that stat is only for the NL for Maddux and for the NL/AL depending on the year for Ryan.

 

And there he performed even worse than Alex Rodriguez has in the playoffs. That's saying something.

 

OK then, I repeat, a .315 career average (which is top 65 all-time), and a .306 career postseason average against what should be in theory top-flight pitching.
Is he overpaid? Probably. But overrated? Don't be stupid.

 

Derek Jeter is a very good player who's acquired Promethean status because of an ESPN generation and the great success of the team assembled around him. He's custom-fitted as can be for his organization, his city and his market. Again, had he been drafted by the Rockies or Pirates, he would be a captain but would not have four championship rings.

Junkie, his team went 1-5. There were some good players on those teams. You just don't hear about them. Everything regarding the Fontes Lions has been recast since he retired seven summers ago.

 

You can't blame Ryan for the fact that Maddux pitched in an era of absolutely atrocious NL pitching.

 

He had one truly awful game. In 1993, he was hurt, didn't even play.

 

Stat geeks agree with you. For example, Clemens got robbed last year and Randy Johnson got robbed before that in his last year in Arizona. The vast majority of BBWAA guys/gals are definitely not stat geeks and they do base the votes on wins alone.

 

I disagree.  Wins are partially team dependent, but as I pointed out Ryan led his team in wins just 6 times.  Even on good teams Ryan barely reached .500.

1979 Angels, 1st place - Ryan's record 16-14
1980 Astros, 1st place - 11-10 record
1986 Astros, 1st place - 12-8 record

Btw, check those stats - Nagy's ERA was 3.41 in 1996 and 4.28 in 1997.  

 

I am comparing them to their contemporaries. A truly great (not borderline HOF guy) would have an amazing ERA, compared to his contemporaries, in any time period or era.

 

Herman Moore's a Hall of Famer.

OK, I'm only half-kidding on that. But Mel Gray is.

 

Overrated.

 

Ryan's ERA is awesome for a power pitcher. Cy Young awards are more a reflection of the team and the peers. And ignoring the strikeouts every time you do one of these stats comparisons is disingenous. People in general don't give a shit about ratio, tho people putting together a pitching staff should. But they care that someone can blow away batters at least 25 percent better than anyone else in history. Has Hank Aaron hit at least 25 percent more homers than anyone else in history? And since when does a 1.24 ratio suck, anyway.

One more point. Maddux's ERA has been ballooning the last 3-4 years. Ryan, the 3-4 years up till that one-season-too-far year that prompted him to retire, had sparkling ERAs.