MVP discussions

Proving once again Jeter is fourth, at best, in the voting. And I'd go Frank Thomas over him. And Johnny Damon. So make that sixth at best.

And FWIW, I might go all apeshit and vote Santana first. But Jeter as a candidate is an absolute joke.

 

Just to get back into this leadership discussion, it does enter into some voter's opinion, and that's not wrong. In many cases, it's significant, like with Willie Stargell in 1979. I don't really see Jeter in that context. Stargell was the guy in that Pirates' clubhouse that every player went to for advice and help. That's why he shared MVP honors with Keith Hernandez, who had an overall better year. But, as Michael Gee pointed out, it's still performance that counts, and Stargell did hit big HRs for a team that won. Jeter had a season worthy of a vote, but not so much better than Morneau or Dye. I still think he will not win.

(And don't forget, only two {2} writers from NY vote so there is no homerism involved here).

As for the NL, yes I would say Pujols is the most dangerous hitter in baseball right now, but how can aybody argue with Ryan Howard? His team didn't win but they did contend, which is what the awards should be all about. I could easily vote for either one of them and feel good about that vote.

That said, I'll say the winners are Morneau and Howard. If I'm wrong, I'll offer my mea culpas all around.

 

Jeter is not a joke.. I think he's 2 or 3 (he and Dye interchangeable)...

Santana, Thomas, Damon, Mauer are next 4 in any order

 

Casty, it seems like a lot of people outside NY are buying into this Jeter-as-MVP thing. He's going to win because he's snookered a whole nation that doesn't see his so-called "leadership" is actually just elitist bullshit.

 

And that only confirms my thought, why should Jeter win?

 

if i'm voting and looking at the jeter-mauer comparison i take into account that the twins starting pitching was mediocre this year (santana excepted, of course). it's an intangible, of course, just like leadership. so i'd vote morneau first, then mauer ahead of jeter.

 

A big, big factor, dismissed only by mopes who have never trying playing the position.

 

I would love know how you can argue for Howard.

I just hear unsubstantiated generalities from you, plus an apparent disregard for defense.

 

Actually, my argument was very consistent. Jeter gets a lot of credit for intangibles, for being the team captain, but he did a lousy job as team captain. The hell with counseling Rodriguez. Try standing up for him to the fans and media like he did for Giambi. But Jeter failed to do that.

And let's face it, that stuff hurt Rodriguez's performance on the field. Make fun of A-Rod for that all you like, but Jeter failed to do something that could have helped make the team better, something that definitely fits under the job of team captain.

Give him credit for a great offensive year and arguably his strongest defensive one, but nothing else.

 

Plenty of good defenses here. Do you think arguing the same thing in 64 different places makes you more right?

http://www.sportsjournalists.com/forum/threads/32488/

 

I don't have a puppy in this one but, Zeke, seriously, who's going to the HOF on that Yankee lineup except Jeter?

 

Alex Rodriguez