One of the strangest moments ...

N ot that I really care about Mr. Pack's fortunes or argument, but:

Actually, I always thought logic works best on those who can gain understanding and enlightenment from it. When used on the intellectually challenged, it is usually a waste of time that is not understood by the recipient, and serves only to make the one spouting said logic feel smarter than he or she actually might be.

That's why it's funny when people say they "used logic to make the racist look stupid." No, the racist already did that to himself. Any "logic" is just an attempt to pile on.

 

Fuck off!


;D

 

So, you're at a table where a guy is saying this ignorant shit. Some others are occasionally laughing at what he says. And you say nothing? Is that your point here -- that I should've just sat there? Or that I should've taken a different approach?

 

Not at all. Merely amused by the chest-pounding, is all. Better to have just told him to shut his trap before he gets stuck with the bill. Works a lot better than "logic," unfortunately.

Did you care to comment on the use of the word "oriental"? Not calling you out, it's just interesting to see it used in a story about shouting down a racist.

 

Yeah, I started this thread to thump my chest, as proven by the one sentence in the original post.

As for "oriental," I must've missed the memo. Or Jim Rome that day. If it's offensive to someone, I apologize. But I'd like to know if I'm alone in failing to realize this is now considered a derogatory term.

 

Asian's usually a little more acceptable than Oriental (though really, Japanese/Chinese/Filipino etc. is better). Dog, I know your hackles are up a little here, but Vinz makes a decent point, and one that I often forget myself, which is that trying to logic a complete dumbass to death is a little bit foolish in itself. You can see countless examples of that on this board.

 

Here's a handy-dandy list of ethnic slurs (as of 8/2/05):
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_ethnic_slurs (it includes "porch monkey" ;D)

As for Oriental, yes, it's offensive to persons of Asian descent in the same way that Negro is offensive to persons of color. It's anachronistic and was often used to derisively describe the negative stereotypes associated with an ethnic group of people. (On a personal note, I learned this when my cousin married a Filipino woman. My grandmother can be incredibly racist, and let loose with "Oriental" a week after the wedding in 1991. Uhh, we QUICKLY learned the difference between Asian and Oriental, why one is acceptable and one is not.)

However, according to <a href="http://news.ncmonline.com/news/view_article.html?article_id=143">this article</a>:

Many Asian Americans are unaware that the term “Oriental” is offensive because the term is often used in their home countries to refer to its citizens, the Philippines included, especially because the Philippines is also known as the “Pearl of the Orient.” In Europe and the United States, however, the term acquired a Eurocentric depiction of the worst of Asian habits and lifestyles. Hence the word “Oriental” was spoken with derision. To Asian Americans who know its historical reference, the term is as repugnant as the “N” word used to slur African Americans. “Many people didn’t realize the term had negative connotations,” Shin legislative aide Scott Passey told PNews how constituents responded to consultations about the issue. “But once they understood, they were very agreeable. A few simply refused to believe the word was negative despite the historical evidence and dictionary references.”

“The major issue here is one of self-identity and self-determination,” Shin stressed. “Members of the Asian community have told me that they are offended to be referred to as ‘Oriental’ in our state statutes. The definition of the word notwithstanding, its various applications, such as ‘exotic,’ ‘strange,’ and so forth is demeaning. While many Asians under European colonial influence have not been educated to the application of the word, they now understand its meaning and connotations. This is similar to the reason why blacks do not wish to be called ‘Negros (sic).’”

 

That site also includes:

BUFFALO, an Irish slur meaning "Big Ugly Fucker From Around Laos"

Hey, a little SportsJournalists.com education never hurt nobody, right?

 

So what does Albany stand for?

 

OK, look, let's just pretend that sentence isn't there. I'm not being all pissy or anything, but my I honestly just tossed that sentence in there and didn't really give it much thought. Now, it's developed into the central theme of the thread. And that -- proving that I was smarter or more intelligent than this dipshit -- was not my intention, either at the restaurant or on this thread. I was just relaying a rather unusual situation.

As for the use of Oriental, I had no idea. It makes me feel somewhat better, since many Asians in this country have no idea either, that apparently I'm not alone.  

 

It's definitely a grey area. And your situation, the actual point, is definitely very strange. I think if I were in that situation, I wouldn't know what to do, watching someone tear down ethnic groups to which they certainly should have at least a passing allegiance. Then again, racism as a whole baffles me anyway, but yeah.