RIP Art Modell

You are pathologically incapable of being civil.
All I said is I wouldn't be surprised if Art had ties to organized crime at some point.
He was certainly suspected of illegal activities by the fans AND his own corporate peers.
Check out the Bob Gries lawsuit in the mid 80s.
That was settled with confidential agreements, but he lost a few million in court fees.
Equivalent to a good year or two running the Browns.

 

Somebody is threatening to move the Louvre?

Point taken, but it's not like you see that everywhere. And the Louvre isn't "just another business" either. Nor are any major museums. Nobody claimed that a pro sports franchise is a city's most important asset. Just that it is an important one, moreso than the average business in town.

Business decisions are made like that all the time, but the emotions run deeper for an entire city when it is a sports franchise than some other big business. Should they? That's another question entirely.

 

Suggesting that the man had ties to organized crime with no evidence to back it up is civil?

 

Comparing the football communities of Jacksonville/Charlotte and Cleveland is so fallacious as not to be seriously entertained, by anyone.
When the Louvre becomes involved it's send-in-the-clowns time.

 

I don't think anyone compared the "football communities."

Perfectly reasonable though to suggest that getting a big league franchise is a very big symbol of being a "big league" town. And that losing one would suggest the reverse.

Also worth noting that Jacksonville and Charlotte both dwarf Cleveland in population and population growth these days.

 

Cleveland didn't "lose" one - it had it amputated.
And there are economic reasons for the growth of those cities and the demise of the other.
Don't be intentionally dense.
Jacksonville is bigger because of sheer mass.

 

In what way is the economic truth 'dense?'

Should a market keep a sports franchise even if the market can't support it?

 

Reminds me of when I worked for the Devil Rays.

I got a meeting with the owners of the BayWalk shopping/dining/entertainment complex in downtown St. Pete.

They were happy to do some joint marketing and promotions with us, and to trade media with us. But, my bosses insisted we get a cash sponsorship out of them, or they could go fuck off.

They pointed out that they had more visitors per year than we did.

And, that's part of the problem with a lot of these sports franchises and their ownership. They bigfoot everyone in town, and act like it's some big privilege to do business with them. And, they expect to get more than fair value for every deal.

 

Now you mean to suggest Cleveland couldn't support the Browns with 80,000 fans every other week, fans around the region and country and an internationally known fan club.
In the most decrepit building in any of the major sports.
A new facility got 70 percent to be replaced on the referendum a few days after the move was announced.
The money was there, as Mayor White said all along.
Modell just was not going to wait around any longer.
Please argue sincerely or we're both wasting our time.

 

Who said anything about the Browns or Art Modell?

I'm just talking about the phenomenology of demographics and 'big league' symbolism.

Should Buffalo keep the Bills if they can't support them? Should Baltimore have lost the Colts? Should Phoenix keep the Coyotes?

 

Respectfully, I am not going to make time to play Socrates with you today, my friend.
These questions have been adequately answered.
(Aside from that, I hardly see how they are germane.)
Offer some declarative analysis instead of the same tired attempts to stimulate critical thinking.

 

Ohhhhhh, are we going to have a Milt Plum discussion? That's always fun.