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SB Nation pulls Daniel Holtzclaw longform piece

Discussion in 'Journalism topics only' started by Steak Snabler, Feb 17, 2016.

  1. The Big Ragu

    The Big Ragu Moderator Staff Member

    Vox is not a "billion dollar joint."

    For one thing, those ridiculous unicorn valuations were peaking right around that round of funding you linked to. Vox shouldn't be worth $1 billion (the actual valuation it reached when Comcast threw silly money in), anymore than it was worth $400 million the year before that -- and when something with little revenue and income keeps going up in value to that extreme, it should clue you in that something is out of whack and you are likely staring at a bubble. If Vox tried to do another round of funding right now, it would magically be much less than a billion dollar joint, btw.

    2014, 2015 are going to be remembered in hindsight as years of ridiculous malinvestment due to a monetary bubble (I won't get into it yet again on here). But it's no different than all of the insane valuations things were getting in 2005 or 2006 only to come back to reality in 2007/2008, or that they were getting in 1998 or 1999 only to be worthless in 2000. Using a valuation as a metric Pets.com was a $100 million company.

    I am not saying Vox Media is a bad company. But it's a company that reportedly had revenues of about $60 million a year and was breaking even in terms of profits when it became a "billion dollar joint." Someone may have thrown ridiculous investment at it, but the business itself is what it is. They likely pay very little because they don't earn anything -- if they are profitable now, it is very modestly profitable. The valuation you are focused on only matters to the venture capitalist trying to get a return on capital. In terms of the business itself, it is a pretty small business that doesn't make much of anything.
     
    OscarMadison and Lugnuts like this.
  2. Double Down

    Double Down Well-Known Member

    I fear we're going to spend the prime of our careers on the losing side of this argument but maybe the Hogan verdict and this Holtzclaw thing changes that. The sad reality is, the slow death of newspapers has changed the farm system. The path we took -- prove you can write 500 words before you write 1,000 -- doesn't exist anymore. So lots of younger writers are being asked to take major league at bats without time in the minors. It's unfair. It sucks. But it's the new world.
     
  3. The Big Ragu

    The Big Ragu Moderator Staff Member

    I was thinking about this, when I looked at the "How to keep moving forward" thread on here started by the kid who was starting his first job at a weekly. He wanted to know how he could move on up to a bigger outlet. ...

    My first thought was" stay young and cheap."

    I think a lot of young writers are being asked to do a lot -- cover major beats, write beyond their experience, etc. -- precisely because they come cheaper than experience. I also don't think it is as insidious as a lot of people on here think, although I do completely understand the resentment. Whether it is a dying newspaper that is teetering on bankruptcy as it continues to bleed revenue. ... or a website trying to grow on online ad revenue (a very difficult way to make money), these are businesses that by their very nature need to keep costs contained.
     
  4. Double Down

    Double Down Well-Known Member

    Writing magazine-length features for a living was probably always a 1 percenter dream in terms of journalism grads, and it still is, but now the people who don't quite get there (either because of talent, ambition or lack of opportunity and connections) have a rougher landing as a fallback. And that sucks. You have to really REALLY want it more than your peers (which might include people younger and older) and get lucky too. So I'm not 100 percent sure what to tell people looking for advice. Work harder than anyone you know and get lucky? That's the reality. It's probably closer to making a living writing fiction than we realize.

    Whatever the answers are, I miss this kind of thread on SJ, which is probably more educational and helpful than grad school and way less expensive. This is kind of how I learned. Reading stuff here, before we became a haven for political fights.
     
  5. JackReacher

    JackReacher Well-Known Member

    This thread is fantastic. Really, really good stuff.
     
    Donny in his element likes this.
  6. Mr. Sunshine

    Mr. Sunshine Well-Known Member

    Shut up, lefties!
     
    Big Circus, YankeeFan and Double Down like this.
  7. dirtybird

    dirtybird Well-Known Member

    As I read through the report, I was struck by how mundane all of it seemed. The idea you'd hold your tongue about your thoughts on a story written by someone that's more senior or forceful, that doesn't seem all that unusual. I see lots of stuff that goes into a paper that I'm pretty sure is trash. I'm some dipshit non-editor in his late 20s, yet I've been the only other set of eyes on a ton of copy that goes straight to print or online for respectable publications (so only one white male is reading, for those counting).

    I guess I'm saying I don't think SB Nation's threadbare approach isn't bad, but I'm saying it's not some sort of rarity of a shitshow. Really good editors are damn hard to find on all fronts.
     
  8. Lugnuts

    Lugnuts Well-Known Member

    Bingo, Rags, Bingo.

    Where are the revenues ?

    Venture capital does not = revenue.

    There's a great article in one of the trades from a few weeks ago... I'll try to dig it up this weekend.... Essentially it said-- at this most recent Upfront advertisers are turning back to cable TV and broadcast and moving away from Internet.

    Why ?

    Nobody can value a click.

    There's a frantic struggle right now to find a correlation between an ad viewed online and sales of that product or service.

    None exists.

    Yet.

    In broadcast and cable, the link is much more reliable -- particularly in the cases of live events and appointment viewing.

    If you want to know about trends and where the real money is-- follow the Upfronts and see where and what companies are buying.
     
    Last edited: May 28, 2016
  9. wicked

    wicked Well-Known Member

    The scary thing, Luggy, is that they've had 20 years now to try to figure out the value of this stuff. OK, only about 10 when it comes to video advertising, but that's still a while.

    They were able to figure out the value of an ad impression on TV a helluva lot quicker.
     
  10. Lugnuts

    Lugnuts Well-Known Member

    It's being worked on, wicked.

    Just reading the last few pages again and thinking....

    There was always so much talk about Grantland and if it was profitable.

    I think the answer is, nobody knows.

    ESPN's ad sales people do such a phenomenal job with creatively pitching sponsors on cross-platform opportunities. So they say to a Nike-- you'll get commercial break X, Y & Z on this live game... You'll be the presenting sponsor on talk show X... And we'll throw in online ads on our digital platforms. The entire package is attractive and far-reaching. SB Nation can't offer sponsors that kind of diversified package under a single brand name.

    As for the future of longform ... It's niche but there's definitely an audience for it. People still love to read and discuss. I prefer longform to books now. If I start a longform and don't finish, there isn't the guilt that there is with an unfinished book. I crave my cerebral, deeply-reported reads-- but in today's modern age-- books are daunting. Longform occupies a sweet spot, and you craftsmen and women can seize on that. Even market yourselves that way.

    I think success in longform will come with establishing small niche brands, probably within larger companies. Readers have to be sure: If I go there and open this link, I know 100% it will be worth my while.

    And the secret sauce: When the metrics point to not only how many... But also to who is reading your material-- now we're talkin'. You longformers are going to love some of your demographics. You might skew a tad older (maybe not) but I guarantee you're read by people with money to spend. Once the ad people get the names, ages, salaries, addresses, kids, pets of every single person who clicks your story... Then the money starts coming in to fund your projects.

    New world indeed.
     
    Donny in his element likes this.
  11. typefitter

    typefitter Well-Known Member

    Now I just want to be held.
     
  12. dixiehack

    dixiehack Well-Known Member

    Are they "damn hard to find" or has their skill set been declared virtually worthless?
     
    BurnsWhenIPee likes this.
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