Screw the general baseball thread, this deserves its own for history...Pirates!

Actually, I disowned them in 1992, because I saw what was coming. And you don't know that the future is bright. It won't be if they don't find a way to keep some of these guys when it comes time to pay them.

I'm not the one who tried to make this out to have some great meaning. micro did that. I just pointed out the many ways he is wrong.

 

I research farm systems and jack off to prospect porn enough to offer a studied opinion. That's all.

People laughed when the Braves and Bills first became shitkickers. Huh? What? Where the hell did they come from? The answer: They'd been quietly laboring for years. It was just ready to come out of the oven. Before you pounce on one strand of thought as you like to do, I'm not comparing the fucking Pirates to them. But they finally seem to have a plan, and have been pouring money into the system and their offshore academy. I might also say that /you/ don't know what their financials will look like next season, especially if they start making money in August and September. I'd read the Cardinals series is going to have some big crowds, not much room for walk-ups, and would expect that to continue in a pennant race.

 

The Pirates have suffered through three issues over the last 20 years -- incompetence, a lack of money and ownership that is not willing to spend what they have. Even if you are right and the first two are becoming less of a problem, they still have that last hurdle to overcome.

You are assuming things that will happen. I'm saying the Pirates still have a lot to prove.

 

They are ahead of schedule. They're doing this without a lot of their goodies coming up through the system.

Blessed to be in a bad division while they get their shit together, unlike a team like the Orioles.

 

Yes, exactly. The AL East is its own animal, with one really smart front office that is almost willing to pay anything (Boston), one front office that is smart and will pay anything (Yankees), ridiculously smart people making the best of a shitty situation (Tampa Bay) and another team that probably makes the playoffs in the past 10 years if they move to the AL or NL Central (Blue Jays).

In any other division, I think you just need a bit of luck and some good planning. It's baseball, and things can pivot very quickly, despite the weird idea that other sports have more competition. (I still think it's mostly because every other sport has more playoff qualifiers.)

 

Partially, but it is also because every other sport does a better job of giving teams the same opportunity to succeed. Not guarantee. Opportunity.

What the Pirates are doing is good and bad for baseball, mostly good. Pittsburgh is absolutely starving for a winning baseball team. The way the town is reacting to even a tiny big of success is proof of that. This is a city that had trouble drawing when the Pirates made the playoffs three consecutive years in the early '90s.

It helps that this is the first half-decent team the Pirates have had since they moved into PNC Park. The "freakshow" of '97 still had Three Rivers Stadium to contend with.

It is a great story for baseball and for my home town and overall it is nice to see.

There is just one drawback. The moment a team like the Pirates has a tiny bit of success, the baseball apologists start insisting that it is proof that they are proving that the system is perfect. Never mind that the Pirates haven't actually done anything yet. Never mind that they haven't proven that they are willing or able to keep their star players this time around. They've had a couple of good months, so that means the Yankees and Red Sox don't have any advantage on them at all!

Of course, when challenged, the apologists admit the advatage exists. They just try to minimize it as best they can and forget the last 20 years. This thread is proof of that.

 

Random thoughts...

Baseball has changed. Trying to hit the ball over the fence with every swing and stiriking out the batter with every pitch is not the way to win baseball games now that the juice has pretty much left the game.

Throw strikes, catch the ball, play smart and run the bases - that is what the Pirates are doing. And people are right, they have some talent in the minors that will grow this team into a legit contender for years to come.

People need to find John Perrotto on Facebook and add him as a friend. Trust me on this one.

McCutchen will be the free agent contract the Pirates have to make a good offer on down the road, or I really think the Yankees will stop revenue sharing. That is a few years from now, though.

Blowing the lead on Saturday night to come back and win in extras on Sunday says a lot about this team.

 

The Rays' management team is brainy and bold, but they got a stroke of luck with the original core of players, cost-controlled, maturing right at the same time. The Orioles are fucked. They'd hoped for that kind of thing, and now some of those guys are beginning to rot on the vine. Every move they make needs to be perfect. Even the veteran placeholders they brought in, stars from the last decade, are performing much worse than expected. These Pirates are no longer dumb enough to sign an ancient Vlad Guerrero/Derrek Lee combo and just hope for the best.

 

You're talking only about the Kansas City Royals. I remember their owner bitching about the need for the salary cap to bring everyone to a more equal level. Well, everyone is closer to being equal. Except of course, the Royals, who royally suck.

 

Oh man I miss the days of the Bucs signing the likes of Derek Bell ("Operation Shutdown"; best self-description ever.)

 

Raul Mondesi, Jeromy Burnitz, and the worst of all, Matt Morris.

The Morris deadline acquisition is one of the worst trades in baseball in the last 10 years.

The Royals should take caution. The Pirates' 1997 draft class was supposed to be outstanding.

http://www.kansascity.com/2011/03/30/2764584/royals-will-try-to-avoid-fate.html

 

Here's the thing about the Royals: It's not just top-end talent like Hosmer, Moustakas and Myers, it's the depth that's behind it. An 18-year-old like Cuthbert who's looking like an international steal ($1.35 million) years ago when Twins SS Miguel Sano and Yankees C Gary Sanchez were supposed to be the best players available. A second baseman like Giavotella who's ready to play every day with the numbers he's putting up at Triple-A Omaha. There are a lot of guys not on Baseball America's top 100 prospects list who are making a name for themselves and rising in status.

Oh, and Bucs win, Brewers lose, which means the Pirates are back in first place by a half-game.

Raise the Jolly Roger!