Ubaldo Jimenez Detained in AZ As Illegal

You send a federal force to the border to stop the in-routes for human and drug smugglers. Building a better wall is nice, but it doesn't mean shit if there's no one around to watch it.

You create a national "guest worker" system that allows for Mexican nationals to work in the US for a determined period of time legally. That helps to regulate the flow of people into the country while largely eliminating the business of human smuggling, which is a giant problem in border states.

You create stiff penalties for businesses that hire illegal immigrants who bypassed the "guest worker" program.

It isn't rocket science, and it doesn't require that every American citizen be order to carry papers at all times. We're better than that.

 

That's a logical fallacy. The fact that I don't believe there's a good solution doesn't mean I can't call a bad solution bad.

 

It's not going to be solved over the 120 minutes (with commercial time) of Anderson Cooper 360.

It took a long time to get to this point; it's going to take a while to sort it all out.

Arizona lawmakers don't appear to want to be part of any grownup solution. Send in the clowns.

 

Correct. The guy who wrote the bill apparently called the Phoenix Suns "anarchists" today because they plan to wear their "Los Suns" uniforms tomorrow on Cinco de Mayo. If there is a grownup solution he will not be a part of it.

 

Sometimes the lack of historical perspective is alarming.

 

So, essentially you're saying there is no solution to the problem? In other words, we shouldn't even try.

Nicely done.

 

Those are all great ideas but apart from some bullshit "limiting our freedom" speech, you've not told me why carrying an ID is such a bad thing for people to have to do.

 

I'm saying that a bad solution is worse than no solution, yes.

 

Two basic things:

(1) The government is there to serve the people, not the other way around. It is fundamentally opposed to our country's history and ideals to be ordered to carry cards everywhere we go so the government can keep tabs on us. You have said it should be carried at all times and shown on demand even for things like buying a car -- if you don't have it you will be "investigated."

Honestly, that's the kind of society you want to live in? Big Brother is that appealing to you? Because honestly, and I don't mean this as a personal attack, to dismiss this as "some bullshit 'limiting our freedom' speech" betrays an almost unimaginable lack of understanding of world history and basic civics. The government has no right to know where I am or what I am doing at this moment. I am not its servant. And this is not a whacked-out libertarian philosophy -- it is a basic premise that our country was founded on.

(2) And perhaps more to the point, it won't do a goddamned thing to stop illegal immigration. Nothing. Unless you're going to suggest going the "full Nazi" where you cannot do anything -- buy lunch, get a loaf of bread -- without displaying your papers, it is a completely ineffective way to deal with immigration.

 

Sorry, maybe I'm just not as paranoid as you are and don't understand how carrying a national ID is any different, right now, than carrying a driver's license.

I'm sitting on my couch scratching my balls right now. Does the government know? No. How exactly would my possessing an ID card change that?

I'm advocating for a simple National ID that would do exactly what my driver's license does now. Hell, it can replace it for all I care. It's a little card that fits in my wallet. Nothing more, nothing less.

Asking people to carry a card like that around is no different than the way we're asked to carry our IDs around now. Do you object when you're at a supermarket at the cashier asks to see some ID before giving you cigarettes or beer? Do you object when you're asked to show your ID to cash a check at a bank? Or how about when you open a new credit card?

We're already asked about 1,000 times to prove who we are. Why is it all of sudden some crime against our country's history to do so?

Are you advocating we get rid of IDs entirely? Because then I could see your point. But right now you're so afraid of some unseen force watching you and what you do that you're not able to see the point yourself.

As for your second point, again, what's your alternative? Just say f**k it and let things happen the way they're meant to happen? Hell, why have border patrol at all with that attitude? Why don't we just let everyone in, regardless of our country's laws and hope nobody with a bad attitude and access to a bomb feels like making a name for him/herself.

 

Oh, for fuck's sake dude, I already went over exactly what I would do to fix illegal immigration. Go back and read it. I said I would dramatically increase the federal force at the border and institute a "guest worker" program. You counter with the magic card.

And one more time, here's the difference between your national ID and a driver's license: your ID is a mandatory card you must carry at all times to prove who you are and that you are where you are allowed to be under threat of jail if you don't have it. A driver's license is something you must carry when you are DRIVING. There's a pretty big difference. There's also a pretty big difference between optional forms of ID issued by the state or other agency and a mandatory ID from the federal government that must be carried at all times under threat of jail.

And again: a national ID would not do jack shit to stop illegal immigration.

 

Do you need a special sticker on your card that allows the ball-scratching?