1. Welcome to SportsJournalists.com, a friendly forum for discussing all things sports and journalism.

    Your voice is missing! You will need to register for a free account to get access to the following site features:
    • Reply to discussions and create your own threads.
    • Access to private conversations with other members.
    • Fewer ads.

    We hope to see you as a part of our community soon!

Writer Cat Fight

Discussion in 'Journalism topics only' started by Boom_70, Apr 9, 2011.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. Mark McGwire

    Mark McGwire Member

    Writing, especially the way Jones and others do it, is a nerve-wracking and self-immolating exercise. You think, when you start, that there will come a day when you're confident in the words you compose, in the bits of yourself you reveal trying to render something fairly, correctly and beautifully. It never comes.

    Writers are needy and self-involved and live for feedback, from readers, from other writers. And even the ones who have the perspective to see that the feedback never fills the hole still feel it.

    Awards are just another facet of that. And I don't think Jones would say he thinks he highlighted the best side of himself, here. But he was honest. He made his readers think. Which led to something more meaningful, eventually, than the awards.
     
  2. Michael_ Gee

    Michael_ Gee Well-Known Member

    SFE, I always thought awards were good things to win, but they were only one of the measures by which I judged the work of others, therefore the same standard should apply to myself. I'm sure everyone's had this experience, but there were columns I wrote that I loved and nobody else noticed, and columns I wasn't that happy with that others, readers, my bosses, etc., told me they really liked.
    In the end, the panel of judges within your head has to have the final say on your self-evaluation.
    And while it's natural and OK to be disappointed for not winning or being nominated for an award, saying so is tacky.
     
  3. GBNF

    GBNF Well-Known Member

    Quite possibly one of the most graceful and lyrical paragraphs I've ever read on SportsJournalists.com. What a beautiful way to put it. God, "In both situations, don't look back."
    Awesome.
     
  4. YGBFKM

    YGBFKM Guest

    People just don't want to hear those at the top of their game talk about how they feel slighted when it comes to further recognition. Imagine Tom Brady or Peyton Manning tweeting they were upset because the other won another MVP. That kind of thing would be met with general derision. Not because such feelings aren't valid, but because it smacks of self-absorption and arrogance to the listening audience.
     
  5. MartinonMTV2

    MartinonMTV2 New Member

    Full disagreement, except for point 3.

    First, the ego stuff makes some places a nightmare. Some people don't ever figure out they are only hurting everyone when they make each mundane story assignment into the Battle of Dunkirk.

    To address some of your other points: I agree that if the paper as a whole does well, then awards can be a good morale booster for the staff. But looking for them as justification is an inconsistent endeavor.

    Why did we enter? Well, at one place, I think it was in the job description. The entry fee was budgeted. I'm fairly certain that saying "We didn't feel like entering" would have been received poorly.
     
  6. MartinonMTV2

    MartinonMTV2 New Member

    Good points. I remember a throw-away column that was well-received. That didn't mean it wasn't below average, though.
     
  7. SF_Express

    SF_Express Active Member

    Well, it was certainly tacky 20 years ago. In this age of blogs and Twitter and everything else, it's harder to avoid. I could also make some kind of case it was honest.

    And Martin, ego stuff indeed can make a place of business a nightmare -- I've certainly experienced the full-blown effects of that across my career -- but it obviously exists, and I still maintain it's part of being a top writer, or a top anything for that matter. Kind of like Kirk's "other half" in another Star Trek moment of note.

    Some simply wear it well, while others don't.
     
  8. YankeeFan

    YankeeFan Well-Known Member

    Anybody who is as open about his feelings as Jones is in his blog posts is opening his/herself to criticism.

    Jones reminds me a little of A-Rod (or maybe Richard Blais for you Top Chef fans). Incredibly talented, but also very insecure and needing constant validation.

    In all of their cases, I feel a little bad for them. They're all great at what they do -- among the very best in their field -- but they don't seem to be able to enjoy it the way they should. And, their insecurity can sometimes come across as arrogance. Or, their constant insecurity comes across as annoying to people who only have a fraction of their talent and don't understand how anyone with the talent they possess could be insecure at all.

    But, it's also part of what makes them who they are. It's part of what drives them and it's part of why they've been so successful.

    I agree that some folks here (Double Down, Secretariat) will rush in to defend Jones under any circumstances. It can get old. Others will attack him for no reason because they enjoy punching up and hope to engage him in pettiness. That gets old too.

    I think it's pretty obvious that Jones is a sensitive guy. Based on Double J's posts, I think he's got to be a good guy with his heart in the right place.

    And, if we're going to "judge" people, then, that's what's most important.

    Jones, you win. You're a good husband, father and friend. Enjoy your writing, don't let it define you. And realize that at your level of fame, someone is always going to be out to "get" you. And those that can't compete with you as a writer will try to find other ways to take you down to their level.
     
  9. GBNF

    GBNF Well-Known Member

    This is such a fascinating topic to me.
    Is there an inherent personality flaw in craving public approval by one's peers.
    Fascinating.

    I'm with Jones on this, entirely, 100 percent, if not for the honesty and candor in admitting it in such a way that left no doubt about his intentions. I've been in the business for five years, and I've won major awards in four of them. I can tell you for certain that I derived more frustration for the fifth year than joy from the fours. Some of us are like that.

    I don't think he necessarily needed to say what he did about the idea that you can't be a good writer or journalist if you don't care about awards. But I agree with him.
     
  10. MartinonMTV2

    MartinonMTV2 New Member

    Some are just not top writers, or even mediocre ones. Ego alone doesn't push them up.
     
  11. SF_Express

    SF_Express Active Member

    Well, understood, of course. But at least to me, no matter how some feel about the way Jones is treated here, I think "top writer" obviously applies.
     
  12. shockey

    shockey Active Member

    i was in the biz for 32 years. was damn accomplished for a stretch, i'm proud to say without bragging; ask anyone who knows the real me that i'm as egoless as they come (even if the sounds, well, egotistical)....

    that said, you like to collect awards, get some ego-gratifying, insecurity confirmation, fine. for young writers starting out and trying to climb the ladder to bigger and better gigs, i totally get it and root for you to see your dreams come true.

    but when accomplished, top-of-the-heap magazine guys like jones -- whose writing i adore -- spouts off about how much award-chasing he still needs to do to feel loved as some sort of affirmation, i just don't get it and realize once again that 'artists' are to be admired for the talents they have and share with us; but in the end are all just flawed human beings who, more often than not, are bound to be found disappointments as people the closer we can examine them. this goes for writers, athletes, entertainers, whatever.

    which is why when you find a truly talented mensch you'd best appreciate him/her. 'cause in the end, they seem to grow rarer and rarer every day. i'm afraid jones is coming closer and closer to buzz bissinger territory...

    no denying his talent. hope that makes his day.
     
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.

Share This Page