With gay marriage decided, what will be the next big left-led social change?

[YankeeFan]

Yes, again, that's equal opportunity screwing. Despite my name, I look very Caucasian. If I moved from CA to NY and went looking for a trade union job—assuming I had trade skills and not pish-ant skills that keep me employed as a journo—would I be able to get in the union? Under what you have said, the answer is no. Again, that's not racism. That's nepotism. A different kind of problem, to be sure, but not the one you seem heck bent to hang the Dems with.

The racism came first, and went hand and hand with the nepotism.

Let's go back to something I posted earlier, which you might have missed:

Due to the Jim Crow laws of the South, there were many Black southern craftsmen who would travel to perform their skills. Many would go to places like New York, Philadelphia, Detroit, etc. and would out compete local white contractors who could not perform as well as they did and could not settle for their affordable pricing. It was because of this, that construction unions in the North were formed to block out Black crews from coming into communities and providing a better service for a cheaper price. Soon after the unions were formed they set in motion the Davis-Bacon Act (named for two New York congressmen). This act set up arbitrary labor wage scales so that Black craftsmen could no longer under price their white counter parts. They all had to pay a certain price, prevailing wage, at a minimum and competition became no more. With the price competition out of the way, the whites moved in through political favor and blatant racism. This would be followed with Project Labor Agreements which meant some projects would be declared "Union Only". With the construction unions discriminating against Blacks, PLA's would also mean "Whites Only".

Black Construction: It's Legacy and Future

 

[doctorquant]

I've worked that corner many a time vis-a-vis the minimum wage. Cranberry et al. have assured me that was entirely on the up-and-up. "Democratic processes" dontcha know ...

 

[YankeeFan]

Anyone want to guess what Senator Davis' trade was before he got involved in politics?

If you said steel worker, pat your self on the back -- but not as hard as you did for liking women's soccer, or for caring about the Confederate flag.

Now Baron, Davis and Bacon were both Republicans, but because of the whole party switcheroo thing, you're going to claim them for your side, right?

Davis was also a supporter of the eugenics movement, but we probably shouldn't read anything into his intentions when he passes a law that locked blacks out of good paying jobs.

 

[YankeeFan]

I've worked that corner many a time vis-a-vis the minimum wage. Cranberry et al. have assured me that was entirely on the up-and-up. "Democratic processes" dontcha know ...

Yep. You helped turn me on to the issue.

Which makes it odd when Cran plays dumb on the issue.

 

[Starman]

157

 

[Baron Scicluna]

Anyone want to guess what Senator Davis' trade was before he got involved in politics?

If you said steel worker, pat your self on the back -- but not as hard as you did for liking women's soccer, or for caring about the Confederate flag.

Now Baron, Davis and Bacon were both Republicans, but because of the whole party switcheroo thing, you're going to claim them for your side, right?

Davis was also a supporter of the eugenics movement, but we probably shouldn't read anything into his intentions when he passes a law that locked blacks out of good paying jobs.

The intention wasn't to lock them out of good-paying jobs, the intention was to prevent owners from using them as cheap labor and to undermine the gains that the unions had earned.

Now, if you want to talk about how they weren't allowed to join the unions, have at it. As we all know, race relations weren't exactly enlightened back then.

BTW, Herbert Hoover signed it into law.


Per Wikipedia, a British official described Davis as this:

"defeated for the governorship of his State in 1942. Commonly known as "puddler Jim" since he started his career as a steel worker. He was born in South Wales, became a Labour politician during the last war and Secretary of Labour shortly afterward. He is violently hated by organised labour, since he is regarded as having prostituted his labour connexion only in order to betray his fellow-workers over and over again. He is a pure opportunist, put into the Senate by the powerful Sun Oil interest in Pennsylvania, declares that he is not an Isolationist. This is true only in so far as he appears to have no convictions of any kind, and will vote in whatever direction is required by the interest which is running him at any given moment."

Seems like Davis would kinda be seen as a moderate, or as a flip-flopper today. He was against 12 and 14-hour workdays, but also in favor of immigration quotas.

 

[YankeeFan]

The intention wasn't to lock them out of good-paying jobs, the intention was to prevent owners from using them as cheap labor and to undermine the gains that the unions had earned.

Try again Baron.

 

[Baron Scicluna]

Try again Baron.

The law did not specifically prohibit anyone from hiring blacks. A contractor wanted to hire them, they were perfectly able to do so. What the law did though, is require them to be paid a certain wage, which the contractors didn't want to do because of their own prejudices. Given the choice, due to their own prejudices, they were going to hire whites over blacks. That was their choice, not the law's mandate.

 

[Bradley Guire]

If I meet a hot alien girl (like one of those triple-breasted ones from Total Recall), I should have the right to marry her. But that would make me a polygamist if I don't divorce my current non-alien wife. I'd be a polygamist alien lover. I don't think society can handle it.

 

[MisterCreosote]

Did they?

The Civil Rights Act? ADA? Lily Ledbetter? Really? Nothing?

I agree with your point that unions have too much political sway, much like people who benefit from Citizens United.

But when their demographics are on par with our national makeup, and multiple people win discrimination lawsuits that punish racist union bosses, etc., I might focus my attention elsewhere. Not for the political reasons some lawmakers do, but because there are much bigger problems that aren't even being addressed at all.

 

[YankeeFan]

But when their demographics are on par with our national makeup, and multiple people win discrimination lawsuits that punish racist union bosses, etc., I might focus my attention elsewhere. Not for the political reasons some lawmakers do, but because there are much bigger problems that aren't even being addressed at all.

So, let's take another look at this. African-Americans facing Jim Crow laws in the South, head North, looking for jobs and opportunity.

In the face of this Great Migration, northern whites, fearful for their jobs, their neighborhoods, and more -- and no doubt clinging to their guns and religion -- enact a variety of measures to keep the Negro in his place.

Among them is the Davis-Baron Act, sponsored by a racist, who was previously a steel worker.

Davis-Baron denies African-American, who are shut out of the labor unions from competing on price for jobs. The law, along with many similar state laws, remains in effect affect place today.

In the mean time, five and six generations of white families have secured good paying union jobs.

But, because we've had a couple of lawsuits -- including one that took 44 years -- work their way through the system, and expose the racism of a couple of these unions, we should declare the situation all good, and move on.

Yeah, I'm sure the guys that discriminated against blacks for 100 years have gotten the message. Young Paddy is going to have to go to college and get a job in a bank. The unions have changed their ways.

We shouldn't put any focus on this, practical issue. This real world form of racism, that robs African-Americans of "economic opportunity".

Hey, there are probably some military bases named after Southern generals that need to be changed.

That kind of symbolic change does nothing to help actual people. it just makes liberal white people feel good about themselves. They'll probably change their Facebook avatar the day Ft. Hood changes its name.

 

[YankeeFan]

The Civil Rights Act? ADA? Lily Ledbetter? Really? Nothing?

By this point I assumed you were referring to the "programs" and "partnerships" Baron mentioned that are working to provide African-Americans with the skills to land good paying union jobs, in unions that discriminate.

I agree with your point that unions have too much political sway, much like people who benefit from Citizens United.

I suppose that's true, but it's a different point.

If companies were acting racist, you wouldn't say, well yeah, but unions have political power, so who cares.

Yes, unions use their political influence for a number of reasons. One of them is to contimue to act in a racist manner, and to lock out competition.

Regardless of anything else, that should be changed.