The New Yorker: Getting bin Laden

[Stoney]

Can you imagine being the guy lying down next to bin Laden's dead body so they could guesstimate his height?

And he was the only guy close to 6 foot. The team must have been all shrimps.

Nowhere does the piece suggest that he "was the only guy close to" 6 feet. It merely points out that 6 ft was his height.

 

[novelist_wannabe]

The food staff at 1600 needs plausible deniability?

 

[novelist_wannabe]

Can you imagine being the guy lying down next to bin Laden's dead body so they could guesstimate his height?

And he was the only guy close to 6 foot. The team must have been all shrimps.

Nowhere does the piece suggest that he "was the only guy close to" 6 feet. It merely points out that 6 ft was his height.

Yeah, it only says they didn't have a tape measure.

 

[doubledown68]

The food staff at 1600 needs plausible deniability?

When the president wants turkey and cheddar, and you give him turkey and American, well... a contingency plan is needed.

 

[Boom_70]

Followed the on line chat. Almost as interesting as the article.

A few questions about Hamza with no real answer. Seems like there is more to that part of story.

Guess they can close nominations for this years National Magazine Awards.

 

[Jack_Kerouac]

The food staff at 1600 needs plausible deniability?

When the president wants turkey and cheddar, and you give him turkey and American, well... a contingency plan is needed.

Or maybe Hillary is just crazy for Costco's pinwheel sandwich platters.

 

[finishthehat]

Reporter's father is a lt. general in the Marines, btw. In the Cyber Command.

 

[Pringle]

Followed the on line chat. Almost as interesting as the article.

A few questions about Hamza with no real answer. Seems like there is more to that part of story.

Guess they can close nominations for this years National Magazine Awards.

I found it interesting that some readers claim to be "misled" into thinking that Schmidle talked to the SEALs because he directly quoted them. I've seen some papers that write this sort of nonfiction short story include an inset with information about how the report was obtained, quotes verified, etc., etc.

When I read it, I admit that I assumed that the writer had been provided open access to everyone - or at least several SEALs - who were in the helicopter and the compound.

That he was not actually makes the reporting more impressive to me, not less. I just figured the administration wanted the whole story out there, and hand-picked a publication - maybe even as an olive branch after banning Lizza from Air Force One because of the campaign cover.

 

[YankeeFan]

So I guess this is one way to become a journalist, huh? Just up and do it.

From Amazon.com's Booklist review of Schmidle's book on Pakistan:

"In 2006, wanting to become a journalist but lacking any journalistic experience, Schmidle decided he would go to Iran, but political upheaval there nixed that plan, so he chose Pakistan instead. After hurriedly gathering background, he spent two years in the country, exploring its past and present, living among its people, writing about them."

CNN's Ben Wedeman & Richard Engel took somewhat similar paths.

Both moved to the Middle East, learned Arabic, and got hired on by local news bureau.

 

[Deeper_Background]

Nothing about the stealth drones?

 

[cyclingwriter]

I want to know why the White House ordered sandwiches from Costco. The West Wing kitchen couldn't handle it?

Joe Biden owns shares in Costco. Joe is always looking to get some extra bucks in his pocket.

 

[three_bags_full]

Settling with power is an aerodynamic phenomenon from which helicopters suffer because they pull air down through a rotor system.

At high gross weights, high density altitudes and high power settings (because they're really heavy), helicopters can begin to "settle in their own downwash." They begin to develop higher and higher rates of descent until the rate of descent is so fast that the air is actually flowing UP through the rotor system, rather than from top to bottom. This causes a vortex ring state around the rotor blades, rendering them pretty much useless.

Have you ever seen the jet wash from an airplane? Those "air circles" that form as a plane lands and the tires create smoke? When helicopters get slow enough -- between 16 and 24 knots, or below "effective translational lift" -- they begin to actually operate in those vortices. If we sink too fast, all that rotorwash is basically shoved back through the rotor system and it screws up the airflow, causing you to develop faster and faster rates of descent. A pilot can correct this problem by simply moving out of the air column, either forward or laterally. But pushing forward on the controls is probably the last thing someone who's trying to stop would do.

That make any sense?

As for the 160th comment, those forkers are always balling up aircraft and killing people. They think their shirt doesn't stink. Well, guess what, assholes. It does.

What effect, if any, did the solid walls of the compound have on the crash, considering they trained on a simulation that had a chain link fence?

If there was an effect, is that something the pilot could have/should have foreseen?

I have landed in dozens of walled compounds in Afghanistan and never gotten anywhere near settling with power.

The more I think about it, the less I believe the settling with power argument. The air would've hit the walls and properly recirculated through the rotor system. Also, settling with power would have begun at higher altitudes (maybe as high as 300 feet above the ground). If that would've happened, it would've been uglier than it was.

The next most suitable solution is that they used too much power when landing because of their high weight and probably higher than expected temperature (bad combination for jet engines). If they went past their maximum power available -- a number that is constantly in your mind when you're near it -- then the engines got too hot and began to shut themselves down, causing the rotors to slow (or "droop," in helicopter lingo) and produce less lift, causing a rapid descent.

After a long conversation with some big brains today, this is the conclusion we came to.

The other thought is that they just hit the forking wall.

Either way, they're lucky as heck they didn't kill a bunch of people.