Verdict reached in Padilla trial

[Webster]

It's a shame that we had to rip up the constitution to get a guilty verdict.

Was there no trial in open court? No Notice and opportunity to present a defense, no notice of the charges, no free defense attorney.Did the court fail to apply the 4,5, 6 and 8th amendments to the Constitution to the defendants? Does he not have a right to appeal?
Seems that the Constitution worked out fine. And he's lucky he's a Muslim on trial in America rather than A Korean held captive by a Muslim Sect in Afganistan

Are you really that dumb or did you forget the blue font?

 

[Fenian_Bastard]

It's a shame that we had to rip up the constitution to get a guilty verdict.

Was there no trial in open court? No Notice and opportunity to present a defense, no notice of the charges, no free defense attorney.Did the court fail to apply the 4,5, 6 and 8th amendments to the Constitution to the defendants? Does he not have a right to appeal?
Seems that the Constitution worked out fine. And he's lucky he's a Muslim on trial in America rather than A Korean held captive by a Muslim Sect in Afganistan

Actually, no, there wasn't a lot of that, as will become apparent when this whole pile of dreck collapses on appeal.
He was convicted -- after three or four years of being tortured in aNavy brig -- of charges nobody ever dreamed of bringing when Ashcroft needed his "dirty-bomb" arrest to hype the scary-terrorist factor for political purposes. The defense was not allowed to bring the circumstances of his interrogation into court because the methods were too secret,
I hope somebody got a good rate on the kangaroo suits.

 

[heyabbott]

[/quote]

It's a shame that we had to rip up the constitution to get a guilty verdict.

Was there no trial in open court? No Notice and opportunity to present a defense, no notice of the charges, no free defense attorney.Did the court fail to apply the 4,5, 6 and 8th amendments to the Constitution to the defendants? Does he not have a right to appeal?
Seems that the Constitution worked out fine. And he's lucky he's a Muslim on trial in America rather than A Korean held captive by a Muslim Sect in Afganistan

Actually, no, there wasn't a lot of that, as will become apparent when this whole pile of dreck collapses on appeal.
He was convicted -- after three or four years of being tortured in aNavy brig -- of charges nobody ever dreamed of bringing when Ashcroft needed his "dirty-bomb" arrest to hype the scary-terrorist factor for political purposes. The defense was not allowed to bring the circumstances of his interrogation into court because the methods were too secret,
I hope somebody got a good rate on the kangaroo suits.

Quite Honestly, I don't give a shirt whether he got Due Process or Not. forkem, put a 40 cal slug in his ear and leave him on the side of the road. I haven't been overly impressed by how our Constitutional Protections have actually protected the citizens of this country lately.
To Quote Bob Herbert's latest column: "It has been almost six years since the attacks of Sept. 11, 2001, when the nation's consciousness of terror was yanked to new heights. In those six years, nearly 100,000 people — an incredible number — have been murdered in the United States. No heightening of consciousness has accompanied this slaughter, which had nothing to do with terrorism. The news media and most politicians have hardly bothered to notice.

At the same time that we're diligently confiscating water and toothpaste from air travelers, we're handing over guns and bullets by the trainload to yahoos bent on blowing others into eternity in armed robberies, drug-dealing, gang violence, domestic assaults and other criminal acts."
Where's your due process now.

Yeah I do understand what I'm saying and I do get what happens if the protections aren't in place. But I don't get that the more the citizens are protected from the government, the less protected we are from each other and the less the government is able to do to protect us. You may pray every night that the man that rapes your child gets a wonderful and zealous attorney to represent him in court, I just want the government to prevent the rape or, at the very least, provide justice for all, not just the accused.

So fork Padilla in the ear with a jack hammer, with or with a trial, I don;t care much right now. Then lets move on to the 2 brutal animals in Connecticut for raping and killing a family. Gut them with a rusty knife without a trial will do more crime prevention than any month of criminal constitutional trials.

 

[Chi City 81]

You, sir, clearly are not American and care nothing for the values upon which this nation was founded.

 

[heyabbott]

You, sir, clearly are not American and care nothing for the values upon which this nation was founded.

You mean slavery and the restricted franchise?

 

[Chi City 81]

You, sir, clearly are not American and care nothing for the values upon which this nation was founded.

You mean slavery and the restricted franchise?

This nation was founded on slavery? We the slaveholders of the United States?

You know what, fork you. I'm not getting into a circular argument with your sick ass.

 

[Fenian_Bastard]

This is from a vice-admiral, and it was put into evidence as to why Padilla got thrown in the brig for three years, and why they can't talk about what they did there. This vice-admiral is in the United States Navy and took an oath to defend the Constitution:

"Permitting Padilla any access to counsel may substantially harm our national security interests. As with most detainees, Padilla is unlikely to cooperate if he believes that an attorney will intercede in his detention. DIA's assessment is that Padilla is even more inclined to resist interrogation than most detainees. DIA is aware that Padilla has had extensive experience in the United States criminal justice system and had access to counsel when he was being held as a material witness. These experiences have likely heightened his expectations that counsel will assist him in the interrogation process. Only after such as Padilla has perceived that help is not on the way can the United States reasonably expect to obtain all possible intelligence information from Padilla."

As for government "preventing the rape," build yourself a time machine and go back to the Soviet Union, or move into a Philip K. deck novel.
I'm sorry you prefer authoritarian solutions -- and I'm sure Bob Herbert would laugh in your face about it, by the way -- but you still, god willing, live in the wrong country for them.

 

[heyabbott]

You, sir, clearly are not American and care nothing for the values upon which this nation was founded.

You mean slavery and the restricted franchise?

This nation was founded on slavery? We the slaveholders of the United States?

You know what, fork you. I'm not getting into a circular argument with your sick ass.

Ask F_B, he'll tell you that without slavery this country would be a colony of the Spanish in Mexico.

 

[heyabbott]

This is from a vice-admiral, and it was put into evidence as to why Padilla got thrown in the brig for three years, and why they can't talk about what they did there. This vice-admiral is in the United States Navy and took an oath to defend the Constitution:

"Permitting Padilla any access to counsel may substantially harm our national security interests. As with most detainees, Padilla is unlikely to cooperate if he believes that an attorney will intercede in his detention. DIA's assessment is that Padilla is even more inclined to resist interrogation than most detainees. DIA is aware that Padilla has had extensive experience in the United States criminal justice system and had access to counsel when he was being held as a material witness. These experiences have likely heightened his expectations that counsel will assist him in the interrogation process. Only after such as Padilla has perceived that help is not on the way can the United States reasonably expect to obtain all possible intelligence information from Padilla."

As for government "preventing the rape," build yourself a time machine and go back to the Soviet Union, or move into a Philip K. deck novel.
I'm sorry you prefer authoritarian solutions -- and I'm sure Bob Herbert would laugh in your face about it, by the way -- but you still, god willing, live in the wrong country for them.

the 100,000 murdered in this country in the last 6 years salute for you your easy patriotism.
The fact that you accept, at face value, the unquestioned truth of our so-called constitutional protections should be beneath your intelligence. They don't work. For 50 years it hasn't worked, more crimes and criminals and a system unable and unwilling to do about it.
So if you think that the Soviet or similar system is the only alternative, you're thinking in the shallow end of the brain pool.

 

[jboy]

Quite Honestly, I don't give a shirt whether he got Due Process or Not. forkem, put a 40 cal slug in his ear and leave him on the side of the road. I haven't been overly impressed by how our Constitutional Protections have actually protected the citizens of this country lately.
To Quote Bob Herbert's latest column: "It has been almost six years since the attacks of Sept. 11, 2001, when the nation's consciousness of terror was yanked to new heights. In those six years, nearly 100,000 people — an incredible number — have been murdered in the United States. No heightening of consciousness has accompanied this slaughter, which had nothing to do with terrorism. The news media and most politicians have hardly bothered to notice.

At the same time that we're diligently confiscating water and toothpaste from air travelers, we're handing over guns and bullets by the trainload to yahoos bent on blowing others into eternity in armed robberies, drug-dealing, gang violence, domestic assaults and other criminal acts."
Where's your due process now.

Yeah I do understand what I'm saying and I do get what happens if the protections aren't in place. But I don't get that the more the citizens are protected from the government, the less protected we are from each other and the less the government is able to do to protect us. You may pray every night that the man that rapes your child gets a wonderful and zealous attorney to represent him in court, I just want the government to prevent the rape or, at the very least, provide justice for all, not just the accused.

So fork Padilla in the ear with a jack hammer, with or with a trial, I don;t care much right now. Then lets move on to the 2 brutal animals in Connecticut for raping and killing a family. Gut them with a rusty knife without a trial will do more crime prevention than any month of criminal constitutional trials.

Wow. Padilla was tortured and sentenced to solitary confinement for three years. What's your excuse?

 

[digger]

It's a shame that we had to rip up the constitution to get a guilty verdict.

Was there no trial in open court? No Notice and opportunity to present a defense, no notice of the charges, no free defense attorney.Did the court fail to apply the 4,5, 6 and 8th amendments to the Constitution to the defendants? Does he not have a right to appeal?
Seems that the Constitution worked out fine. And he's lucky he's a Muslim on trial in America rather than A Korean held captive by a Muslim Sect in Afganistan

Actually, no, there wasn't a lot of that, as will become apparent when this whole pile of dreck collapses on appeal.
He was convicted -- after three or four years of being tortured in aNavy brig -- of charges nobody ever dreamed of bringing when Ashcroft needed his "dirty-bomb" arrest to hype the scary-terrorist factor for political purposes. The defense was not allowed to bring the circumstances of his interrogation into court because the methods were too secret,
I hope somebody got a good rate on the kangaroo suits.

Quite Honestly, I don't give a shirt whether he got Due Process or Not. forkem, put a 40 cal slug in his ear and leave him on the side of the road. I haven't been overly impressed by how our Constitutional Protections have actually protected the citizens of this country lately.
To Quote Bob Herbert's latest column: "It has been almost six years since the attacks of Sept. 11, 2001, when the nation's consciousness of terror was yanked to new heights. In those six years, nearly 100,000 people — an incredible number — have been murdered in the United States. No heightening of consciousness has accompanied this slaughter, which had nothing to do with terrorism. The news media and most politicians have hardly bothered to notice.

At the same time that we're diligently confiscating water and toothpaste from air travelers, we're handing over guns and bullets by the trainload to yahoos bent on blowing others into eternity in armed robberies, drug-dealing, gang violence, domestic assaults and other criminal acts."
Where's your due process now.

Yeah I do understand what I'm saying and I do get what happens if the protections aren't in place. But I don't get that the more the citizens are protected from the government, the less protected we are from each other and the less the government is able to do to protect us. You may pray every night that the man that rapes your child gets a wonderful and zealous attorney to represent him in court, I just want the government to prevent the rape or, at the very least, provide justice for all, not just the accused.

So fork Padilla in the ear with a jack hammer, with or with a trial, I don;t care much right now. Then lets move on to the 2 brutal animals in Connecticut for raping and killing a family. Gut them with a rusty knife without a trial will do more crime prevention than any month of criminal constitutional trials.
[/quote]

I'm really worried about this country and where we're heading. (and not just because of heyabbott. Add in people who say their main concern is national security, and think that the current president is doing a good job on it. The chances of anyone actually being hurt by a "terrorist'' here are probably 1 in say 20,000,000, but people are worried about the bogeyman because that's all the current administration can count on to keep people from realizing they've completely screwed everything up. And the fact that some people actually believe one of our political partys would be more willing to let terrorists come after us.)

 

[Point of Order]

Quite Honestly, I don't give a shirt whether he got Due Process or Not. forkem, put a 40 cal slug in his ear and leave him on the side of the road. I haven't been overly impressed by how our Constitutional Protections have actually protected the citizens of this country lately.
To Quote Bob Herbert's latest column: "It has been almost six years since the attacks of Sept. 11, 2001, when the nation's consciousness of terror was yanked to new heights. In those six years, nearly 100,000 people — an incredible number — have been murdered in the United States. No heightening of consciousness has accompanied this slaughter, which had nothing to do with terrorism. The news media and most politicians have hardly bothered to notice.

At the same time that we're diligently confiscating water and toothpaste from air travelers, we're handing over guns and bullets by the trainload to yahoos bent on blowing others into eternity in armed robberies, drug-dealing, gang violence, domestic assaults and other criminal acts."
Where's your due process now.

Yeah I do understand what I'm saying and I do get what happens if the protections aren't in place. But I don't get that the more the citizens are protected from the government, the less protected we are from each other and the less the government is able to do to protect us. You may pray every night that the man that rapes your child gets a wonderful and zealous attorney to represent him in court, I just want the government to prevent the rape or, at the very least, provide justice for all, not just the accused.

So fork Padilla in the ear with a jack hammer, with or with a trial, I don;t care much right now. Then lets move on to the 2 brutal animals in Connecticut for raping and killing a family. Gut them with a rusty knife without a trial will do more crime prevention than any month of criminal constitutional trials.

All well and good until someone tosses you behind bars and throws away the key.