Rewriting, Washing, Scrubbing American Culture

[Spartan Squad]

Totes. I used the line without thinking. It was a denigrating line in 1987 just as it is in 2023. I own that.

Yes it was denigrating in 1987 but that whole movie is meant to be a snap shot of a denigrating moment in US history. The war was denigrating, the people figuring it were denigrating and the people trying to survive it were as well. The movie is fine. It was how it was referenced.

But I'm willing to move on. I'm also willing to admit the phrase you are calling me hypocritical about is wrong too. I don't believe I have used it since the last person to point out how wrong that phrase is. I am sorry for it's use. I won't use it going forward.

 

[Alma]

Of course it is.

You're in here banging the pots and pans for the LEFTIST CULTURAL REVOLUTION THAT NEVER QUITE ARRIVES, IN WHICH ALL THE OLDS AND CLUELESS BOURGEOISIE WILL BE TAKEN FROM THEIR HOMES AND SENT INTO THE COUNTRYSIDE FOR RE-EDUCATION.

While the right is actually pulling books off the shelves; closing libraries; and heaving wrong-thinking academics off the parapets.

What's funniest is that you're the one who introduced the phrase rhetorical sleight-of-hand to the thread.

Why would an analysis of the new cultural left does not first require a universally-agreed-upon disclaimer about the cultural right?

Why would that be the price of admission in participating in this thread?

Why are you creating a price of admission in the first place?

 

[Spartan Squad]

Why would an analysis of the new cultural left does not first require a universally-agreed-upon disclaimer about the cultural right?

Why would that be the price of admission in participating in this thread?

Why are you creating a price of admission in the first place?

Because this thread wasn't about the "cultural left." It was about making a reference on a racist way. But you would know that if you, you know, read.

 

[Alma]

Of course it is. It's the textbook definition of misdirection.

You're in here banging the pots and pans for the LEFTIST CULTURAL REVOLUTION THAT NEVER QUITE ARRIVES, IN WHICH ALL THE OLDS AND CLUELESS BOURGEOISIE WILL BE TAKEN FROM THEIR HOMES AND SENT INTO THE COUNTRYSIDE FOR RE-EDUCATION.

I never wrote this. I wrote "syncretism." In other words, the left being fused with more conservative establishment values, and the establishment co-opting left values and sanitizing them for mass consumption.

That's precisely what the prosperity gospel is; capitalism dulling down the radical, offensive-to-rich-people edges of Christianity to the point where the churches couldn't reject Trump out of fear of losing their parishioners attendance and money.

I am suggesting the anti-establishment left - which lived to mock, offend and stir the pot - will undergo the same thing. And maybe it should! I'm just saying, it will.

 

[Spartan Squad]

I never wrote this. I wrote "syncretism." In other words, the left being fused with more conservative establishment values, and the establishment co-opting left values and sanitizing them for mass consumption.

That's precisely what the prosperity gospel is; capitalism dulling down the radical, offensive-to-rich-people edges of Christianity to the point where the churches couldn't reject Trump out of fear of losing their parishioners attendance and money.

I am suggesting the anti-establishment left - which lived to mock, offend and stir the pot - will undergo the same thing. And maybe it should! I'm just saying, it will.

And yet the right is banning books, limiting free expression, canceling history, restricting freedom of religion, doubling and tripling down on racist ideas and twisting yourselves into thinking you're not the bad guys here. The left of saying don't be assholes. Jesus said don't be assholes. The right says it's my freedom to be an asshole, screw anyone who says otherwise. But sure "the cultural left."

 

[Liut]

This forking thread still rolling? Me hate it long time.

 

[Regan MacNeil]

It's nice that now pretty much everyone else sees Alma for what he is.

 

[Slacker]

It's nice that now pretty much everyone else sees Alma for what he is.

He Alma you long time.

 

[Alma]

Because this thread wasn't about the "cultural left."

We disagree and not because you're wrong, if that makes sense.

The depiction was inappropriate in 1987 when Kubrick filmed it. The use of the line was inappropriate in rap songs. Kubrick himself made what I'd even describe as inappropriate films - or at least inappropriate scenes in films. But he made them, and to the extent people were shocked by them was, at the time, more a commentary on them than it would be Kubrick. (It's just a movie! It's art!)

Now, those scenes and movies are a commentary on who Kubrick was. That's what's changed. And in the case of Kubrick (especially the three last films) how good or durable that art is.

 

[Alma]

And yet the right is banning books, limiting free expression, canceling history, restricting freedom of religion, doubling and tripling down on racist ideas and twisting yourselves into thinking you're not the bad guys here. The left of saying don't be assholes. Jesus said don't be assholes. The right says it's my freedom to be an asshole, screw anyone who says otherwise.

No one disagrees with any of this. Not me, not anyone here. None of this is in dispute, and the thread was not started as a response to some right-wing debate on the board.

Jesus said don't be assholes. The right says it's my freedom to be an asshole, screw anyone who says otherwise.

Yes, agreed. I wrote something quite similar ITT.

I think it's more the question of, who gets to decide what is jackass behavior. What are the terms? Most-easily offended person in the room wins?

Christianity has a generally surprising answer to that question, and it's: Yeah, probably.

Be careful, however, that the exercise of your rights does not become a stumbling block to the weak.

It's what the Christian right really doesn't get.

But sure "the cultural left."

In this thread? Yes!

The thread wasn't started because someone called out Songbird for being irreverent toward Jesus, after all. Or too casual about the dangers of drugs or drinking or gambling. Or any other thing that the right clutches its pearls over. Those kinds of people don't post here anymore. (If they ever really did.)

The movie line that gave offense - and I agree that it is offensive - probably isn't something the cultural right would find offensive. Charlie Kirk and Ben Shapiro and Clay Travis probably don't care about a line from FJM. The people of this board did, and this board is nothing like those three names. So while we certainly can talk about the Kirks and Clays of the world, I'm not sure there's any tension to explore there. I'm not sure there's any thread of length to that aspect of the topic that hasn't already ribboned itself through 20 other threads. But if there is...start that thread.

 

[dixiehack]

No one disagrees with any of this. Not me, not anyone here. None of this is in dispute, and the thread was not started as a response to some right-wing debate on the board.



Yes, agreed. I wrote something quite similar ITT.





In this thread? Yes!

The thread wasn't started because someone called out Songbird for being irreverent toward Jesus, after all. Or too casual about the dangers of drugs or drinking or gambling. Or any other thing that the right clutches its pearls over. Those kinds of people don't post here anymore. (If they ever really did.)

The movie line that gave offense - and I agree that it is offensive - probably isn't something the cultural right would find offensive. Charlie Kirk and Ben Shapiro and Clay Travis probably don't care about a line from FJM. The people of this board did, and this board is nothing like those three names. So while we certainly can talk about the Kirks and Clays of the world, I'm not sure there's any tension to explore there. I'm not sure there's any thread of length to that aspect of the topic that hasn't already ribboned itself through 20 other threads. But if there is...start that thread.

My observation is twofold:

1. I have yet see the evidence that qualifies you as an expert on "the cultural left" despite your certainty of how they act and think in every circumstance. It would be like me holding forth on the sociology of Brooklyn.

2. You need a change-up pitch in general.

 

[doctorquant]

... your certainty of how they act and think in every circumstance.

If you're not much for "certainty [with respect to] how they act and think in every circumstance," I would suggest you avoid this thread ...

President Biden: The NEW one and only politics thread

... at all costs.