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Masters Running Thread

"He just missed."


You're right, I can easily buy that, gag was the wrong term. Athletes don't necessarily choke when they fail.

As I said earlier, over a four-day period Immelman played better than the rest of the field. Tiger and his "A' game or anyone else and their "A" game had nothing to do with it. Everyone tried to play as well as they could over 72 holes, and Immelman's best was three strokes better.

Feherty and Bayless, among others, just can't accept that.
 
I just seriously think that golf is a lot harder than many of you (or really all of us), understand. Everyone says "Well, he didn't bring is A game." Well, that's the thing with golf. It's pretty much impossible to bring your A Game each time out. A lot of stars had to align in 2000 for him to have the season he did, including the fact that he's the most talented golfer who ever lived. A lot of this psychoanalysis -- he gagged, he didn't gag, the pressure is getting to him, it's not, he can't play from behind, he has family on his mind -- sort of overlooks the fact that the margin for error in golf is so tiny, even talent isn't enough to overcome every other player in the field some weeks. It's why golf is a "feel" game as much as it's about skill. To say, "He's always going to win if he plays his best" is kind of silly because it's essentially true of all the top players. It's just very difficult to be even close to your best all the time. He's spoiled you in the past because he was so good sometimes, you remember his great shots and great tournaments more than his so-so ones. And there have been so-so ones. Did he gag at Carnoustie this past year when he finished 12th? How about two years ago when he missed two short eagle putts on the back nine at the Masters, letting Mickelson waltz to a victory? How about at the 2004 PGA when he shot 73 on the final day and finished 24th? Was the pressure getting to him? No, it just wasn't his week. Jack Nicklaus had those weeks too.

From 1970 to 1980, the best stretch of his career, Jack Nicklaus played in 44 major championships. He won 10, and finished in the top 10 (including those wins) a ridiculous 39 times.

So even when he was the baddest golfer walking the planet, right in the middle of his peak, Jack was still only winning majors less than once every four times he teed it up. Was he suffering from too much internal pressure? Was he choking when facing his own legend? Or was he just playing pretty good golf that sometimes wasn't good enough?

People, I think, misinterpret the desire to see Tiger come from behind and win a major. Yes, he may win 25 majors, win them all while holding a 54-hole lead, and hang up his spikes as the best who ever lived. But seeing him come back isn't as much the need to see him prove himself when the chips are down as it is the desire to be entertained -- to be thrilled -- by the unexpected. It's easy to be in awe of domination, and it's entertaining to a point. But it's never as thrilling, as exciting, as the charge. When I think about all Tiger's major victories, my favorite is never the 12-stroke victory at the Masters in 97, or the total beat down he put on the field at Pebble Beach.

It's the playoff victory over Bob May at Valhalla. That's all I want to see. More of those. More drama. I want to be in awe of his gifts, but I also want to be riveted. It's a lot more fun than a 18-hole parade. That's why people want to see him storm back in a major.
 
Double Down said:
I just seriously think that golf is a lot harder than many of you (or really all of us), understand. Everyone says "Well, he didn't bring is A game." Well, that's the thing with golf. It's pretty much impossible to bring your A Game each time out. A lot of stars had to align in 2000 for him to have the season he did, including the fact that he's the most talented golfer who ever lived. A lot of this psychoanalysis -- he gagged, he didn't gag, the pressure is getting to him, it's not, he can't play from behind, he has family on his mind -- sort of overlooks the fact that the margin for error in golf is so tiny, even talent isn't enough to overcome every other player in the field some weeks. It's why golf is a "feel" game as much as it's about skill. To say, "He's always going to win if he plays his best" is kind of silly because it's essentially true of all the top players. It's just very difficult to be even close to your best all the time. He's spoiled you in the past because he was so good sometimes, you remember his great shots and great tournaments more than his so-so ones. And there have been so-so ones. Did he gag at Carnoustie this past year when he finished 12th? How about two years ago when he missed two short eagle putts on the back nine at the Masters, letting Mickelson waltz to a victory? How about at the 2004 PGA when he shot 73 on the final day and finished 24th? Was the pressure getting to him? No, it just wasn't his week. Jack Nicklaus had those weeks too.

From 1970 to 1980, the best stretch of his career, Jack Nicklaus played in 44 major championships. He won 10, and finished in the top 10 (including those wins) a ridiculous 39 times.

So even when he was the baddest golfer walking the planet, right in the middle of his peak, Jack was still only winning majors less than once every four times he teed it up. Was he suffering from too much internal pressure? Was he choking when facing his own legend? Or was he just playing pretty good golf that sometimes wasn't good enough?

People, I think, misinterpret the desire to see Tiger come from behind and win a major. Yes, he may win 25 majors, win them all while holding a 54-hole lead, and hang up his spikes as the best who ever lived. But seeing him come back isn't as much the need to see him prove himself when the chips are down as it is the desire to be entertained -- to be thrilled -- by the unexpected. It's easy to be in awe of domination, and it's entertaining to a point. But it's never as thrilling, as exciting, as the charge. When I think about all Tiger's major victories, my favorite is never the 12-stroke victory at the Masters in 97, or the total beat down he put on the field at Pebble Beach.

It's the playoff victory over Bob May at Valhalla. That's all I want to see. More of those. More drama. I want to be in awe of his gifts, but I also want to be riveted. It's a lot more fun than a 18-hole parade. That's why people want to see him storm back in a major.
That's a big part of it.
 
Just watched Immelman do the Top 10 list for Letterman.

Delivered it very well.


10. I've been elevated from "unknown" to "obscure."
8. Now I don't look so foolish for trademarking "Immelmania"
6. President Bush called to congratulate me on winning Wimbledon.
5. When my caddy recommends a club I can say, "Excuse me, how many Masters have you won?"
2. Guess who's playing 36 holes with the Pope this weekend?
1. Get to put my arm around Tiger Woods and say, "Maybe next year."

Now Caliendo is on there doing his Pacino... oh wait, it really is Al.
 
Bitching that Tiger has never come from behind on Sunday is like bitching that a baseball player didn't win a batting title by hitting the best on Wednesdays.

Who gives a ship?
 
Zeke12 said:
Bitching that Tiger has never come from behind on Sunday is like bitching that a baseball player didn't win a batting title by hitting the best on Wednesdays.
No, it's not, but whatever makes you happy.
 
Sure, it is. Golf tournaments are decided by low score of four rounds. Whether you post the lowest round on Thursday or Sunday does not matter.
 
Zeke12 said:
Sure, it is. Golf tournaments are decided by low score of four rounds. Whether you post the lowest round on Thursday or Sunday does not matter.
If you think the same environment exists on Thursday as it does on Sunday on a course at a major, I really can't help you.
 
doubledown68 said:
Boobie Miles said:
The Tiger failure to come from behind angle is understandable because there's not much left to say about the guy. But whoever the guy on First Take with Skip Bayless today (I know, I know, for some reason I sometimes punish myself and watch a few minutes of it) had a great rebuttal to Bayless scoffing at Woods only winning when ahead. How is that a bad thing? It's NOT a bad thing to be in such control on Saturday that no one has a chance to touch you on Sunday, or if you have even a one-stroke lead going into Sunday show's over because no one's catching you. Who cares how they're being won? That's like complaining if a team is winning titles by sweeps instead of having to fight back from a deficit in a 7 game series.

And as bad as this show is, this guy against Bayless isn't too bad. At least he has cogent arguments and actually calls Skip on his ridiculousness instead of the other idiots who just try to out-shout Bayless. An example: Bayless was saying Immelman "backed into the win" because Woods didn't challenge him and he shot a 75 on Sunday. The response: It's pretty tough to say someone backed into a win when they've led wire-to-wire. When you have a big lead on Saturday you only have to play good enough to win on Sunday. Hearing logic on this show was jolting.

God I hope that's the last First Take oriented post I ever make.

Edit: Oh Jesus, Skip is ranting now how he's still not sold on LeBron. I need to get out of the house.

Listening to Skip will send you to an early grave. And if he said Immelman backed in, well, the dude has less brain cells than I thought.

Far as I could tell, Immelman played one bad hole of 72, and by that time, he could afford a little stumble. As it was, Immelman made great shots to build the lead, and had some great par saves on Sunday to keep it. More than anyone, including the great El Tigre, could claim over that four days.

I'm as big a Tiger homer as you'll find, but Immelman didn't back into this thing. He won it, period.

That was as smooth a 75 as you could ever witness in a ball-buster of a tournament like The Masters.
 
Tiger gets ripped because he never says anything noteworthy. Then, when he says winning the grand slam is within reason, he gets ripped for that. He wins 13 pro majors, more than anyone not named Nicklaus, but he gets ripped because he didn't come from behind to win any. What if he came from behind to win all 13? Then he'd be somebody who won because the guys ahead of him folded, not because he took charge of the event himself. He can't win no matter what he does.
 
TwoGloves said:
Tiger gets ripped because he never says anything noteworthy. Then, when he says winning the grand slam is within reason, he gets ripped for that. He wins 13 pro majors, more than anyone not named Nicklaus, but he gets ripped because he didn't come from behind to win any. What if he came from behind to win all 13? Then he'd be somebody who won because the guys ahead of him folded, not because he took charge of the event himself. He can't win no matter what he does.

Was kinda thinking the same thing.

And when he comes from behind to win, people will say that the competition sucked, the course was easy or he wasn't playing lefthanded.
 
JR said:
TwoGloves said:
Tiger gets ripped because he never says anything noteworthy. Then, when he says winning the grand slam is within reason, he gets ripped for that. He wins 13 pro majors, more than anyone not named Nicklaus, but he gets ripped because he didn't come from behind to win any. What if he came from behind to win all 13? Then he'd be somebody who won because the guys ahead of him folded, not because he took charge of the event himself. He can't win no matter what he does.

Was kinda thinking the same thing.

And when he comes from behind to win, people will say that the competition sucked, the course was easy or he wasn't playing lefthanded.

Yes, cuz Lord knows we've never seen or heard any writer/analyst diminish the victory of someone else when Tiger didn't have his "A" game or didn't tee it up that week.

Christ, all the Four Horsemen on Monday's Around the Horn could talk about was how disappointing Immelman's "victory" was because the final-round scores were so high and no one made a back-nine charge...

Blah, blah, blah.

Immelman played incredibly well for three rounds, well enough to build a five- or six-shot lead heading into the final round and that was good enough to allow him a few missteps on Sunday.

So he didn't pull away and crush the field by 10 shots or more. So what. He still won.

He finished at 8-under. It's not like he took home the green jacket with a 1-over or something and he beat the best in the world.

Yet the Four Horsemen didn't think it was good enough.
 

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