No No. 4 in Super Bowl 44: The Running Thread

[zagoshe]

Did anyone say "Brees has a better team around him!!!!!" BEFORE this Super Bowl?

Yes, I did - which is why I picked them to win 27-17.

And I think most people felt they had a better running game and more balanced offense, better special teams and a defense that was similar to the Colts only more opportunistic...

But keep trying to convince yourself that nobody respected the Saints before the game because Tony Dungy picked the Colts.... :

I didn;t say anything of the sort.

I just think it's funny that "Wow, Manning threw a key pick there" is responded to with "The Saints clearly have a better team around BREES!!!!"

That's bullshirt. No one felt that way - OK, zagoshe, in your latest effort to be contrary for the sake of it, maybe you did - before the damn game.

You really are being a thin-skinned fanboy douche about this.

Nobody is trying to dis or down play how good Drew Brees is or played.

The point was made in response to the idiotic and tired "Peyton Manning choked and blew another big game" knee-jerk from some of the Peyton Manning haters around here.

 

[suburbia]

All great quarterbacks lose more than one big game. That's because they get to play in more of them than anyone else.

True. Even Montana and Brady and Bradshaw and Aikman lost some big games.

I guess the thing with Manning is that he's lost far more of them than the first three. I'm not pinning tonight on him - even if he ends up throwing a TD instead of a pick-6, the Saints may very well have driven down the field and kicked a walk-off field goal to win 27-24. But the number of rings don't lie - for all of his regular season success, he only has one ring. The other four have at least three, and two have four.

How many of those "big game" losses that you are talking about did Manning lose with the better team?

He lost twice in the AFC title game on the road against one of the great dynasties of all-time.

He lost twice to the Chargers and mostly because that is a horrible matchup for the Colts.

The only big game he's lost in which he had the better team was against the Steelers. One time.

That is it.

The first loss against the Chargers was when the Chargers didn't have either LT (back when he was still a great player) AND Rivers. He lost to f'ing Billy Volek, for crying out loud.

His second playoff loss was to Jay Fiedler and a mediocre Dolphins team that just happened to win its division. The Colts should have led 24-0 early and instead only led 14-0 because they twice settled for short FGs and turned the ball over on downs in the red zone another time. His great offense let the Dolphins hang around and eventually win in OT.

I agree on the losses to the Titans, Jets and Patriots.

Again, most QBs would love to have Manning's track record, let alone win a championship. But people are going to look back on Manning 30 years from now and wonder how he could put up such great numbers and his teams could be so consistently good in the regular season but only win one championship.

 

[cjericho]

Since 2001 here's the quarterbacks that Manning has lost to in the playoffs:
Ben Roethlisberger



Chad Pennington
Tom Brady (twice)
Phillip Rivers (twice)
Drew Brees
Jay Fiedler

And here are the ones he's beaten:
Jake Plummer (twice)
Trent Green (twice)
Tom Brady (the signature win of his career)
McNair (with Ravens)
Rex Grossman
Joe Flacco
Mark Sanchez

Steve McNair (with Tennessee)
as opposed to McNair with Alcorn State

 

[Double Down]

Steve McNair (with Tennessee)
as opposed to McNair with Alcorn State

Did you read the whole post, or just wipe clean from your mind the part where he beat McNair and the Ravens in the playoffs too?

 

[cjericho]

All great quarterbacks lose more than one big game. That's because they get to play in more of them than anyone else.

True. Even Montana and Brady and Bradshaw and Aikman lost some big games.

I guess the thing with Manning is that he's lost far more of them than the first three. I'm not pinning tonight on him - even if he ends up throwing a TD instead of a pick-6, the Saints may very well have driven down the field and kicked a walk-off field goal to win 27-24. But the number of rings don't lie - for all of his regular season success, he only has one ring. The other four have at least three, and two have four.

How many of those "big game" losses that you are talking about did Manning lose with the better team?

He lost twice in the AFC title game on the road against one of the great dynasties of all-time.

He lost twice to the Chargers and mostly because that is a horrible matchup for the Colts.

The only big game he's lost in which he had the better team was against the Steelers. One time.

That is it.

The first loss against the Chargers was when the Chargers didn't have either LT (back when he was still a great player) AND Rivers. He lost to f'ing Billy Volek, for crying out loud.

His second playoff loss was to Jay Fiedler and a mediocre Dolphins team that just happened to win its division. The Colts should have led 24-0 early and instead only led 14-0 because they twice settled for short FGs and turned the ball over on downs in the red zone another time. His great offense let the Dolphins hang around and eventually win in OT.

I agree on the losses to the Titans, Jets and Patriots.

Again, most QBs would love to have Manning's track record, let alone win a championship. But people are going to look back on Manning 30 years from now and wonder how he could put up such great numbers and his teams could be so consistently good in the regular season but only win one championship.

in the loss to SD last year Sproles went off. that game was better than any LT ever had in the playoffs. the def and def coordinator get to wear that one.

 

[suburbia]

Since 2001 here's the quarterbacks that Manning has lost to in the playoffs:
Ben Roethlisberger



Chad Pennington
Tom Brady (twice)
Phillip Rivers (twice)
Drew Brees
Jay Fiedler

And here are the ones he's beaten:
Jake Plummer (twice)
Trent Green (twice)
Tom Brady (the signature win of his career)
McNair (with Ravens)
Rex Grossman
Joe Flacco
Mark Sanchez

Steve McNair (with Tennessee)
as opposed to McNair with Alcorn State

The first Chargers loss was against Billy Volek. Rivers got hurt during the game and didn't play much.

 

[Piotr Rasputin]

Did anyone say "Brees has a better team around him!!!!!" BEFORE this Super Bowl?

Yes, I did - which is why I picked them to win 27-17.

And I think most people felt they had a better running game and more balanced offense, better special teams and a defense that was similar to the Colts only more opportunistic...

But keep trying to convince yourself that nobody respected the Saints before the game because Tony Dungy picked the Colts.... :

I didn;t say anything of the sort.

I just think it's funny that "Wow, Manning threw a key pick there" is responded to with "The Saints clearly have a better team around BREES!!!!"

That's bullshirt. No one felt that way - OK, zagoshe, in your latest effort to be contrary for the sake of it, maybe you did - before the damn game.

You really are being a thin-skinned fanboy douche about this.

Nobody is trying to dis or down play how good Drew Brees is or played.

The point was made in response to the idiotic and tired "Peyton Manning choked and blew another big game" knee-jerk from some of the Peyton Manning haters around here.

Yes, because my years of Saints fandom are clouding my judgment.

Peyton Manning was marching his team down the field.

It was a big game; there's none bigger.

Peyton Manning was league MVP this season, and is now The QB The Media Likes To Fellate.

This game was seen as a chance for Peyton manning to cement his legacy as an all-time great (I believe I posted such a sentiment as the final drive began).

Peyton Manning threw a key interception that was returned for a decisive score.

Not sure how any of this can be argued.

 

[cjericho]

Steve McNair (with Tennessee)
as opposed to McNair with Alcorn State

Did you read the whole post, or just wipe clean from your mind the part where he beat McNair and the Ravens in the playoffs too?

missed that. guess that's why it had (Tennessee)

 

[mb]

SUCK IT, kid that wore the Colts jersey in New Orleans. Suck it long and hard.

 

[2muchcoffeeman]

Do they really have to do "America the Beautiful?" Isn't the actual national anthem enough?

Yes, because this is the post-9/11 United State, where we must pander to some ridiculous idea of what constitutes patriotism....

The idea of a washed-up rapper who can't sing performing America the Beautiful being patriotism is indeed ridiculous.

Can't sing? Are you effin' high?

http://www.amazon.com/Travlin-Light-Queen-Latifah/dp/B000S9JS4M
http://www.amazon.com/Dana-Owens-Album-Queen-Latifah/dp/B0002XL1XU

 

[zagoshe]

All great quarterbacks lose more than one big game. That's because they get to play in more of them than anyone else.

True. Even Montana and Brady and Bradshaw and Aikman lost some big games.

I guess the thing with Manning is that he's lost far more of them than the first three. I'm not pinning tonight on him - even if he ends up throwing a TD instead of a pick-6, the Saints may very well have driven down the field and kicked a walk-off field goal to win 27-24. But the number of rings don't lie - for all of his regular season success, he only has one ring. The other four have at least three, and two have four.

How many of those "big game" losses that you are talking about did Manning lose with the better team?

He lost twice in the AFC title game on the road against one of the great dynasties of all-time.

He lost twice to the Chargers and mostly because that is a horrible matchup for the Colts.

The only big game he's lost in which he had the better team was against the Steelers. One time.

That is it.

The first loss against the Chargers was when the Chargers didn't have either LT (back when he was still a great player) AND Rivers. He lost to f'ing Billy Volek, for crying out loud.

His second playoff loss was to Jay Fiedler and a mediocre Dolphins team that just happened to win its division. The Colts should have led 24-0 early and instead only led 14-0 because they twice settled for short FGs and turned the ball over on downs in the red zone another time. His great offense let the Dolphins hang around and eventually win in OT.

I agree on the losses to the Titans, Jets and Patriots.

Again, most QBs would love to have Manning's track record, let alone win a championship. But people are going to look back on Manning 30 years from now and wonder how he could put up such great numbers and his teams could be so consistently good in the regular season but only win one championship.

I see, it was Manning's fault that the Colts defense let Billy Volek, come into the game cold in the fourth quarter and lead an 80 yard drive for the winning touchdown?

If anything that game speaks to the Colts biggest problems - they can't stop good teams from scoring and thus if the offense doesn't score on every possession or nearly every possession, they can't beat good teams.

 

[Double J]

With all the hype that the Super Bowl and the NFL get, the Vince Lombardi Trophy is pretty plain and uninspiring as a championship trophy.

It's no Stanley Cup, that's for sure. I've seen paperweights with more style.